Packers Snap Counts - Packers Vs. Patriots Preseason Game 2

The Packers play pretty well in a loss to the Patriots in preseason game two.

 

The Packers dominated the first half, gaining 18 first downs to 10 for the Patriots, and 256 yards to 127 for the Patriots.  Their time of possession was over 18 minutes with New England at 11 minutes and change.  The score didn't reflect that due to a turnover.

 

Player Snaps % STs
Walker 43 74 3-15%
Newman 41 71 3-15%
Nijman 41 71 3-15%
Rhyan 41 71 2-10%
Hanson 34 59 None
Runyan 17 29 1-5%
Myers 17 29 1-5%
Tom 17 29 None
Jenkkins 17 29 None
Telfort 15 26 None
Schneider 7 12 2-10%
DeLance 0 0 2-10%

 

The number one offensive line was effective in the three to four drives it played.  The coaches finally gave Rasheed Walker the snaps with the starters at LT.  It is more difficult to judge players who only play against backups.  I think Walker passed this test.  The starters were Walker, Jenkins, Myers, Runyan, and Tom.  Walker played 17 snaps with the starters and Love, and 26 of the 41 snaps with Clifford at quarterback, with Telfort playing the balance of 15 LT snaps.  Nijman played every snap Clifford played.  Newman and Rhyan played LG and RG, respectively.  Hanson played 34 of the snaps when Clifford was at quarterback, with Schneider playing the remaining 7snaps.  

The pass protection was good for both Love and Clifford.  Pro Football Focus indicated that the offensive line only gave up one hurry.  The run blocking dropped off significantly when the starters began to depart, though the Packers still had Nijman and Walker at offensive tackle.

On the first drive the packers ran the ball 3 times for 16 yards, but a bad shotgun snap led to a turnover on 3rd and five.  Love had one imcomplete pass to Deguara.  The turnover gave the Patriots the ball at the Green Bay 18.  On the second drive, the Packers ran the ball twice for 6 yards, and Love attempted 5 passes, completing 3 for 23 yards.  On 3 and 4, Love threw an incompletion while attempting to hit Reed.  Love targeted Musgrave 3 times.  That forced a punt.

On the third drive, the Packers ran the ball twice for 9 yards (3 for 20 if one includes Love's scramble, but QB scrambles are always a separate category for me).  Love completed 2 passes on 2 targets for 63 yards.  He hit Doubs for 42 yards.  The pass was a little under thrown, and Doubs had drifted towards the sideline a bit, but he got both feet in bounds, at least after the Packers won that challenge.  He threw a 21-yard bullet to Reed who snatched it out of the air.  RBs gained 31 yards on 7 carries (Jones 1 for 6 yards, Dillon 6 for 25), while Love was 5 of 8 for 86 yards and a touchdown.  The Packers converted 1 of their 3 third down attempts, but one of them was due to the bad snap.

On the fourth drive, the Packers ran the ball 6 times for 36 yards.  Wilson had 4 carries for 28 yards, Taylor 2 carries for 8 yards and a touchdown.  The blocking was mostly very good, though Wilson had a 1 yard run on 1st and 10 and Taylor got stuffed for no gain on another 1st and 10.  Clifford connected on 2 of 3 passes for 21 yards.  Musgrave got just enough of the end to seal the edge, allowing Taylor to beat the defenders around left end and score the touchdown.  The Packers did not face a third down on this drive.

On their fifth drive, the Packers ran the ball 6 times for 14 yards.  They had successful runs by Wilson for 7 yards and Taylor for 2 yards on a 4th and one.  Taylor worked for those 2 yards.  All the other runs would be considered unsuccessful given the down and distance.  Clifford completed all three of his passes, including a nice 21-yarder to Dubose, but they failed to convert both 3rd down plays, leading to a punt.

On their 6th drive, which started at the Green Bay 9-yard line with just 51 seconds left in the half, Clifford completed 3 of 6 passes for 32 yards.  A somewhat questionable pass interference call on New England on a 2nd and 10 moved the ball another 23 yards.  After failing to convert 3rd and 5 at the New England 34, Carlson hit a 52-yard field goal to put the Packers up 17 to 14 at the half.  There were no runs on this drive, though the Packers still had 2 timeouts.

 

Player Snaps % STs
Clifford 41 71 None
Love 17 29 None

Love completed 5 of 8 passes for 84 yards (10.5 yards/attempt) with 1 touchdown and no interceptions.  He was not sacked, nor do I remember any quarterback hits, excluding hits on a scramble that was penalized for unsportsmanlike conduct, and another while he was attempting to recover an errant snap.  Love had a 137.5 passer rating.  He scrambled twice for twice for 11 yards, with a long of 11.  The errant shotgun snap looked off line, and Love appeared to be looking to the right side of the field when the snap occurred.  Officially, Myers was cited for a fumble on the play.  Clifford completed 13 of 19 for 137 yards, (7.2 yards/attempt) with no touchdowns or interceptions.  He had a passer rating of 89.1.  Clifford scrambled once for 2 yards.  Clifford was not sacked and New England did not have any official quarterback hits.  Nonetheless, despite a much less potent running attack, the Packers scored on 2 of their 3 possessions with Clifford at quarterback.  

        

Player Snaps % STs
Em Wilson 27 47 2-10%
Dillon 16 28 None
Taylor 14 24 11-55%
Jones 1 2 None

Emanuel Wilson started out with 4 carries for 28 yards, but as the starters on the offensive line cycled out of the lineup, good holes and yards became scarcer, particularly up the middle.  Wilson finished with 63 yards on 15 carries, a 4.2-yard average, with a long of 14 and no touchdowns.  Wilson caught 2 of 2 targets for 15 yards, with a long of 11.  He looked very comfortable catching passes, made some nice decisions and cuts on his runs, and overall looked good.  Wilson at least cracked the special teams squad, but only got 2 snaps, whereas Patrick Taylor played 11 ST snaps after playing 12 in the first preseason game.  Taylor gained 12 yards on 4 carries, a 3-yard average, with a long of 8 and a touchdown.  Taylor powered for 2 yards on a 4th and 1, gaining the first down despite not much push from the offensive line.  His other two runs featured a lot clogged running lanes.  He checks all the boxes for RB #3, though Wilson is closing the gap and seems more explosive with the ball in his hands.  Dillon gained 25 yards on 6 carries with a long of 5.  He was very consistent, but all of his carries (and thus yards) came while the first string offensive line was on the field.  Dillon picked up a blitz well, pushing the defender into the ground.  Aaron Jones gained 6 yards on one carry.

Player Snaps % STs
Kraft 32 55 6-30%
Musgrave 24 41 2-10%
Allen 11 19 8-40%
Deguara 10 17 2-10%
Pearson 3 5 7-35%

Kraft played the most snaps but was not targeted.  Then again, according to Pro Football Focus, Kraft only ran one pass route.  [I am wondering if that's a misprint because PFF has his snaps count incorrect.]  Luke Musgrave caught 2 of 3 passes for 13 yards with a long of 10.  [I believe Musgrave was targeted a fourth time but the play was wiped out by a penalty.]  PFF indicated he ran 16 routes.  Austin Allen was not targeted and PFF indicates that he did not run a route.  Deguara caught one of 2 passes for zero yards while running 2 routes.  Allen got a longer look on STs.  Pearson only blocked.  He had a holding penalty called on him, and left the game with an injury. 

 

Player Snaps % STs
Heath 37 64 6-30%
Toure 23 40 7-35%
Dubose 23 40 4-20%
Doubs 17 29 None
Watson 17 29 None
Watts 12 21 1-5%
Wicks 9 16 3-15%
Reed 9 16 None
Chrest 4 7 None
Bonds 1 2 None
Miller 0 0 9-45%

Christian Watson ran 9 routes but was not targeted.  Doubs ran 9 routes and caught both of his targets for 52 yards, with a long of 42.  Reed ran 6 routes and caught of 2 targets for 19 yards with a touchdown.  Wicks played 9 snaps but ran no routes.  Malik Heath caught all 5 of his targets for 75 yards, with a long of 25.  He caught tough passes, took big hits but still caught the ball, and when he caught a 10-yard slant just short of the first down marker, he fought successfully to get the extra yard or two he needed.  He blocks ferociously.  He played special teams.  Heath is going to be very difficult to cut.  Toure palyed 23 snaps and had 1 target and no receptions.  He was injured while he was a returner on special teams, and was seen on the sidelines with ice on his left knee.  Dubose caught 2 of 4 targets for 27 yards with a long of 21.  He has looked good.  Watts caught one pass for 9 yards.  Chrest caught one pass for 6 yards, but played no STs.  Dre Miller played only STs.

 

Player Snaps % STs
Wooden 43 74 3-15%
Brooks 37 64 2-10%
Ford 24 41 2-10%
Wyatt 15  26 1-5%
Slaton 12 21 2-10%
Slayton 7 12 None

Wooden had 3 tackles (1 solo) and a QB hit.  Brooks had 1 solo tackle, 1 tackle for loss, and 1 QB hit.  I personally credited him with 2 pressures.  Jonathan Ford had 2 solo tackles including a tackle for loss.  Wyatt had 1 solo tackle.  Slaton had no statistics.  Slayton had 1 solo tackle.  Kenny Clark did not play.  The Packers allowed 4.83 yards per carry to running backs, and 9 yards on 3 scrambles to quarterbacks.  They allowed a 15 and a 23 yard run as the two explosive runs.

Player Snaps % STs
J Phillips 39 67 6-30%
Cox 30 52 3-15%
Wilson 26 45 1-5%
Banks 23 40 8-40%
Mosby 17 29 11-55%
Van Ness 17 29 1-5%
Walker 15 26 1-5%
Enagbare 14 24 4-20%
McDuffie 13 22 1-5%
Hollins 11 19 9-45%
P Smith 4 7 None

 Phillips has gotten little attention but is always active.  He led the Packers with 6 tackles (5 solo) and a pass defensed (batted down).  Eric Wilson had 3 tackles (2 solo).  Enagbare in just 14 snaps had 2 solo tackles including a tackle for loss, 2 sacks, 1 pass defensed, 1 forced fumble and 1 fumble recovery.  He has taken a clear jump and is OLB #3.  He also had a tackle on special teams.  Van Ness, Quay Walker and K. Banks each had 2 solo tackles with Banks adding a pass defensed.  McDuffie and Brenton Cox each had one solo tackle with Cox adding a QB hit.  Hollins had 1 QB hit.  The packers finished with 6 QB hits and 2 sacks.  The pass rush has looked good from all of the outside linebackers, except perhaps for Van Ness.  Brooks, Slaton, and Ford and Wooden have gotten some push.

I wonder if the Packers were taking a longer looks at other player on special teams or if McDuffie and Eric Wilson, who normally play a lot of ST snaps, were held back while Devondre Campbell is out?  

 

Player Snaps % STs
Valentine 58 100 9-45%
Thomas 47 81 10-50%
Jean-Charles 43 74 8-40%
A. Johnson 40 65 11-55%
Owens 27 47 None
Moore 20 34 1-5%
Sapp 12 21 9-45%
Carpenter 12 21 4-20%
R. Ford 11 19 2-10%
Nixon 9 16 None
Savage 6 10 1-5%
Douglas 6 10  1-5%
Leavitt     3-15%
Hooper     2-10%

Valentine came down to earth a bit but still looked pretty good.  He had 2 solo tackles and 2 passes defensed, and a PI or 2.  Kiondre Thomas had a questionable Pass Interference penalty called on him.  He had 2 solo tackles and a pass defensed.  Jean-Charles had 3 tackles, 2 solo.  Anthony Johnson had 4 tackles, one solo.  He was not in coverage but arguably he was the one who failed to tackle Boutte on his 42-yard TD reception caught between the hashmarks, much of which was yards after the catch.  Owens had 1 pass defensed.  Carpenter had 2 assisted tackles.  Moore had one assisted tackle.  Carpenter, Nixon, Leavitt, and Savage had no statistics.  Ford had 2 assisted tackles and Dre Miller had one special teams tackle. 

 

Carlson made all of his kicks.  One snap from Ozrech was a little high, but O'Donnell got it down on time.  Whelan punted twice for 63 yards with no returns.  Both were inside the 20, but the Patriots took possession at the 17 and 15 yards lines, respectively, so that is far less impressive.  O'Donnell punted once for 43, no return.  Toure returned 2 punts for 3 yards and 2 kickoffs for 36 yards.  There might have been penalty on every return.  Indeed, this refereeing crew called penalties on most of the returns, and easily threw the flag on pass interference calls.

     

Photo courtesy of Wm. Glasheen, USA Today Sports

WR: 2.62

TE: 1.38

RB: 1.00

 

DL: 2.38

LB: 3.60

DBs: 5.02

 

 

 

 

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7 points
 

Comments (41)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2023 at 07:26 am

I forgot, Brooks had an outright sack erased by a penalty.

Telfort is strictly PS material until he develops. Not sure where that puts him given the Mt. Caleb and Tenuta are still around, if banged up. Newman and Rhyan don't look ready to contribute even in the event of injury, though Rhyan might come around. I've been calling for Hanson to be released because he is terrible. He wasn't good, and the run game went to hell when he, Newman and Rhyan came in, but he didn't look as abjectly terrible as he has in the past.

How annoyed must Nijman be? No snaps with the number ones during this game. He is looking like the backup swing tackle who might not play much this year. If he thought he still had upside he could demonstrate this year at RT or LT, it might not be happening for him in his contract year.

I never have understood what role Deguara is going to play on this team. Pearson is a better FB. I know, LaFleur is going to use him as the perfect chess piece. Still waiting.

I am guessing Hooper would have gotten some snaps had the game not been suspended with the bulk of the 4th quarter to go.

4 points
4
0
HarryHodag's picture

August 20, 2023 at 08:28 am

My cynical side tells me part of the issue is they don't want to pay Nijman a new big contract. So he's demoted. I'm reasonably certain David Bahktiari won't last the season. Nijman is the logical replacement, but next season he could bolt for much bigger money somewhere where a team needs a left tackle(like the Jets). So the Packers have loaded up on tackles in the hope of finding one who will replace David B. this year(likely) AND next season.
As cynical as that is, I think there's some grain of truth to it.

2 points
2
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HarryHodag's picture

August 20, 2023 at 10:29 am

As I was in the bathroom contemplating the universe another thought struck me: could Nijman be on the trading block? Maybe to the Jets? His Darkness is aware Nijman is a good left tackle and the Jets o-line is a big question mark.
The Packers seem comfortable with the tackles they have and not having to sign Nijman next season would be a plus given an even tighter salary cap.

2 points
2
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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2023 at 11:22 am

I have previously raised the possibility that GB might trade Nijman. Since he attracted no offer sheets even though other teams knew GB could not match any significant offer zi that had money up front, and he didn't bother to wait until the offer sheet window closed, I suspect the price teams were willing to pay was a late 3rd or 4th. Perhaps a few injuries might change that.

2 points
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RobinsonDavis's picture

August 20, 2023 at 12:55 pm

Great article, TGR! I feel strongly that the Packers just wanted to see what they had in Walker (and Caleb Jones, if he was not injured) against this type of defense. Likewise, I am in agreement with you that Nijman is on the trade block, and that the Packers may have already received or are anticipating inquiries, hence Walkers heavy duty at left tackle. Where I differ, is that Packers would be willing to take less in trade, a 4th or 5th round pick for him given that his likely comp pick equivalent would provide at best a 5th round section IN 2025, But likely 6th round pick. My point?...IF Nijman is to be traded, I would like a higher or potentially equivalent pick in this coming year's draft vs. waiting another year. I do love Josh though.

1 points
1
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Guam's picture

August 20, 2023 at 08:53 am

Loved watching Dillon run the ball with a QB under center. He is much more effective getting up a head of steam than with the stutter step handoff from a QB in shotgun.

I think the Packers have a problem with depth at the IOL. None of the backups have demonstrated much ability to be effective replacements for the starters. I hope Gute can find a waiver wire cut to help there. And I wanted to be patient with Rhyan, but I now suspect he will continue the third round curse.

Conversely the Packers have found another solid OT in Walker. He has played very well in both the Bengals and Patriots games. Kudos to Gute for another late round gem.

Wooden and Brooks have been very pleasant surprises on the D-line and have played well in both preseason games. Finally some help for Clark and depth on the D-line!

I thought Enagbare might make a second year jump and he certainly has played very well in both preseason games. Brenton Cox has been hot and cold, but has lots of athletic ability. Hollins looked good against the Bengals, less so against the Patriots. Should be some interesting battles for the OLB spots.

The pre-draft book on Valentine was he can be too aggressive and get himself into trouble. He lived up to that evaluation last night. He has talent, but is also raw and needs refinement in techniques and angles taken..

I like what I have seen from the Packers so far!!!

4 points
4
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greengold's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:42 am

My thinking on Nijman differs. I think he knows he’s been assured of getting either starting position, or the #3 OT, depending on Bak’s actual return, and what happens with Myers.

They’re probably waiting until the money is figured out in extending all of Gary, Bakhtiari & Nijman, keeping OL a strength in GB at the Tackle position. They’ve got a possible Runyan extension to pile into that as well.

Nijman is a proven, known & trusted quality. I don’t think they’ve entertained Nijman being anywhere else but GB, and Nijman likely feels the same. Tom moving to C, Nijman starting at RT and Walker showing aptitude at LT are all pluses, and maybe Gutekunst & LaFleu’s desired vision. Despite us fans not having seen Tom with the 1s.

Getting this “lay of the land,” might be essential in getting the $$$ side of this straightened out, sacrificing #1 reps for Nijman, who doesn’t need them.

2 points
2
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T7Steve's picture

August 21, 2023 at 10:32 am

I was looking forward to seeing your snap counts TGR. Thanks!

Tried to record the game on the NFL network and got the Steelers and Bills instead. Next scheduled showing is Wednesday, so I hope I don't get another recording of Steelers and Bills.

After returning from the cabin, the stats on the NFL network didn't even show Love's so I thought he didn't play.

Sure seems that there was a lot of starting QBs playing extended snaps this week. Is the trend of not playing starters going away? Even saw Maholmes with quite a few passes.

0 points
0
0
WD's picture

August 20, 2023 at 07:54 am

It sure looked like a bad snap from center caused the fumble. However, in fairness it was pointed out by the announcer that Love was looking the other way when the ball was snapped ."What the hell is going on out there" .....Lombardi

0 points
0
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HarryHodag's picture

August 20, 2023 at 08:21 am

Love was checking whether he should audible out of the play when it was snapped. (Milwaukee Journal-Sentinel) Myers thought a lineman was jumping offside so he snapped the ball. It was about 80-20 Myers fault. Good it happened in an exhibition game. They will work on that much this coming week.

But, again, it doesn't count toward the Super Bowl, so why fret?

4 points
5
1
CheesedDeadHead's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:46 am

"Myers thought a lineman was jumping offside so he snapped the ball. It was about 80-20 Myers fault. "

I would put it 99/1 if your Center is making a decision like that.

I'm sure they can fix this in a few minutes by explaining to Myers the QB decides when the ball is snapped, not HIM.

And by my count that was 2 FU's on 1 play for Myers (no offsides was called and the ball flew past the QB and lead to an easy 7 points for NE). Clearly competition is improving his play... (/sarcasm)

2 points
3
1
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2023 at 10:04 am

LaFleur said it was Myers. He saw a movement and snapped to get a penalty free play but it wasn’t close (in LaFleur’s words) to the line of infraction. Bad call on his part. He has to be more spatially aware not just hair trigger on movement. It was also high and wide. All Myers.

4 points
4
0
egbertsouse's picture

August 20, 2023 at 08:11 am

I’m glad to see someone reinforcing my perception of Deguara and Hansen. Deguara doesn’t block extremely well and when he catches the ball he makes Richard Rodgers look like Carl Lewis. I read they like Hansen because he plays multiple positions but he appears to stink at all of them.

5 points
7
2
HarryHodag's picture

August 20, 2023 at 08:22 am

The only thing I keep thinking is Hansen must have something on the coaching staff, otherwise why would they keep him around? He's either breaking down or injured. Most places he would have been gone long ago.

2 points
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CheesedDeadHead's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:58 am

"The only thing I keep thinking is Hansen must have something on the coaching staff, otherwise why would they keep him around?"

Unfortunately since Butkus was promoted to OL coach, there have been many head-scratching moves that even the least informed fan thought was a bad decision and it took Butkus weeks of failure to make a correction. Which OL has actually improved over the last 2 years? Nijman was the LT for the entire year Bakhtiari was out protecting AR and AR was upright until the NFCCG. Now Nijman is the backup who gets the fewest reps on #1. That isn't improving an asset, that's malpractice. Just as Newman and Hanson have been and now the only clear improvement from Rhyan has been better conditioning and learning the playbook. A player does that in his own interest 99% of the time, not under a coaches "instruction". Newman is a mess. Hanson has always been a mess. Myers thinks he saw a DL jump so he hiked the ball even though Love wasn't ready. Mentally a mess for multiple players with the only ones who are capable are those that have superior physical capabilities to overcome their "coaching."

2 points
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MooPack's picture

August 20, 2023 at 10:09 am

Tongue in cheek, but maybe Butkus is subtly sabotaging The OL in deference to his old man.

1 points
1
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Canam73's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:23 am

"I read they like Hansen because he plays multiple positions but he appears to stink at all of them."

We've been needing somebody to fill that Don Barclay role.

1 points
1
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Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2023 at 10:45 am

Except that Barclay was decent at first, till he badly injured his lower leg. I’ve never seen Hanson look good. Actually, last night was probably one of his better performances. He was adequate for the seconds.

2 points
2
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lou's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:46 am

The Carl Lewis remark made me chuckle, somehow Rodgers has lasted 9 seasons in the NFL, great hands and a tenacious blocker but it looks like he is running in quick sand. Hansen is consistent, he gets rag dolled no matter what offensive line position he plays, remember he spent his first season on the practice squad which is RARE for a drafted player in Green Bay.

0 points
0
0
LambeauPlain's picture

August 20, 2023 at 08:38 am

Heath making the 53? Shoot...he's flirting with being the #3 WR! His route running makes creates space but it is his competitive "want to" going up and taking HIS ball. It's his and the DB isn't entitled to it.

I can't recall a rookie Packer UDFA WR who consistently showed so much talent and desire from OTA's through the second preseason game.

6 points
7
1
Guam's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:02 am

Not only is Heath a good receiver, but he BLOCKS! He is just as aggressive in his run blocking as Lazard was. Between receiving, blocking and special teams play I don't see how this kid doesn't make the team. I think Watson, Doubs and Reed have the top three WR spots, but Heath is #4 for me and ahead of Toure and the others.

3 points
3
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greengold's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:18 am

Agree, LP & Guam! That kid is special too! We have so many at WR. I could easily see Gutekunst using every trick in the bag to make optimal use of PS, PUP & IR to keep all of our WRs in the fold. I’m hopeful Wicks & DuBose’s injuries weren’t too serious. I love all 3 of those guys, plus Melton.

Heath is ready to start in this NFL.

0 points
0
0
4thand10's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:35 am

I agree and I don’t see him being cut. After the camp he has had combined with his pre season performance how could he be cut? You’re right, he plays with authority, confidence and performance. We all know Nixon is going to be getting return snaps otherwise they would not have signed him. My suspicion is that they wanted to get a closer look on Toure and that he might actually be the bubble spot.

Dubose and Wicks would be the PS stashes. Just a guess. I’ll touch on Deguara… He does it all. In past seasons he has caught passes, played fullback, played tight end and played special teams. The very few last resort bail- out- the- qb passes that have came his way this preseason he was over or underthrown because the QB was under duress so i would cut him slack.
Nijman always shows up and has himself a game, I like the player. He shows up regardless and does whatever is asked. Totally luxury to have a backup left tackle or left guard and he is more than competent at those positions.

Cole Schneider played extremely well in his limited snaps at center so i’m keeping an eye on him.

Valentine plays sticky coverage and isn’t afraid to tackle..I’d gladly take a penalty per game for that and I’d rather have that than someone running wide open for a TD. I’d definitely take the good and the bad with him because the talent is clearly there.

I have been impressed with kiondre thomas. I have seen him carry 2 fast WRs 20-30 yards down field step for step resulting in incompletions. Could be a mirage, but he also appears to be a dude not afraid of contact, can tackle and defend a deep pass.

0 points
0
0
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2023 at 10:50 am

I didn’t look closely at Schneider. He seems raw at C, but I do like his physicality. Is he good enough for the PS to develop? Right now he’s probably our 2nd healthy safety, since we won’t play Tom. I’d mention Jenkins and even Runyon, but what’s behind them isn’t something that lets me.

0 points
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0
Grandfathered's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:00 am

What happened to Bo Melton?

1 points
1
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greengold's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:20 am

Bo suffered a hamstring last week. Nothing too serious, as he was running off to the side in practice with other rehabbing players during Wednesday & Thursday’s joint practices.

1 points
1
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Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:33 am

Wicks with a hammy this week. Those injuries tend to linger enough to mess things up at this point. I was looking forward to seeing him yesterday.

1 points
1
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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:21 am

'Melton missed practice on Wednesday with a hamstring. I assume he couldn't go Saturday.

1 points
1
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WD's picture

August 23, 2023 at 11:21 am

A good question. I believe Bo is injured but no updates. Same with RB Goodson. Hopefully they will both be in a position to make the team. Bo was a gunner on special teams as well as the fastest player on the roster. I really like both of them. Both have super speed which too many minimize in my opinion.

0 points
0
0
Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:30 am

I’m not sure I agree on the run blocking getting worse with the second line. In fact I thought it was better on the inside although Jenkins was better individually. Hanson was better than I’d have expected but not special and got injured again and in the run game at least Rhyan is better than Runyon. It seemed to me that the perimeter run blocking was strong all night in both sides, at least until Telfort, who is a bit hit and miss at this point.

Valentine is probably overly physical at this point, but I think it’s a case of over called in this game as opposed to under called previously. A good learning experience, but he’s always there and shows vision and technique. There were a lot of borderline calls, but Thomas being called for being taken out by the receiver was dreadful.

Heath really impressed me. He’s looking like a more versatile Lazard. If Musgrave is healthy I just wonder how big that role is though. Wicks’s hammy may shake that up in his favor. I think DuBose looks good but that he’s going to the PS now. The other wrinkle is that Wilson just has “it”. If a back was hurt then I’d want him starting. I think with STs though, Taylor is the best 3rd down back to have active. Keeping 4 running backs over an extra receiver may be the better strategy. Can Heath make the 5th WR? Do he and Wilson now have too much on tape to make a PS—or is that just over-rating our own!

Wooden as well as Brooks were impressive. Cox too, but he showed his inexperience. Banks and Phillips would have strong cases in previous years.

This is a heck of a good 90. I hope it’s as good a final roster. We have a lot of promising depth. Getting the optimal mix tk retain will be critical.

I don’t want to see Love throwing to Doubs next week. I want to see him with Toure/Heath/Melton/Wicks/DuBose (although only 3 may be healthy—the best who are). He’s going to have to throw to guys not named Doubs/Reed/Watson among the WRs in season. I’d take Musgrave out of the mix too. We are going to need to see Kraft/Allen.

I do not understand the competition at S. Savage has been ok and that seems to be enough to lock him in. The others, it’s blink and they’ve changed them. I’d love to know what that’s showing. I’d like them to pick two not named Savage and test them at length. If they can’t separate them that confidently by now, I’d take that as a sign none are good for us.

4 points
4
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Guam's picture

August 20, 2023 at 09:42 am

You might want to rewatch the game CW. The Packers weren't getting nearly the same yardage inside after the #2s replaced Jenkins-Myers-Runyon. The pass pro looked okay when the #2s were in there, but the interior run blocking suffered. I think TGR got that spot on.

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Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2023 at 10:37 am

I will be, but aside from Jenkins, I didn’t see too much contribution from other interior OL. Myers did fail to get out and sustain a block that could have sprung a big run beyond 5 yards. Just got pushed back into the Lane.

The fact is, Newman/Hanson/Rhyan were a lot better in pass pro than I feared (not hard given expectations of the first two). Hopefully that’s a good sign from Rhyan though. His run game isn’t his obstacle. Again, the tackles were our best players with the seconds.

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Guam's picture

August 20, 2023 at 11:30 am

I thought Runyon played decently in both pass pro and the run game. Myers was barely adequate in run blocking, decent in pass pro and had that bad turnover. I really wish the Packers would give Tom a shot at center. Maybe the development of Walker will allow Tom to slide inside.

Newman-Hanson-Rhyan were decent in pass pro and that was a surprise. I just expected more from Rhyan in the run game as that should be his strength. The Packers will keep him for at least one more year given his draft status, but I am growing concerned about his progress.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2023 at 11:00 am

Wilson entered the game on the 18th snap. Jenkins, Myers, Runyan and Tom departed after 17. Walker stayed, and Nijman entered. Newman and Rhyan played every remaining OG snap. Hanson came in for Myers. Wilson caught a pass for 11 to the left flat. Wilson then gained 9 (R End), 4 (L End), 14 (middle), and 1 yard (R Tackle) on 4 consecutive carries. 4 for 28. Then Taylor, right end for no gain, and then left end for 8 yards and a TD. That's the first series with Clifford.

Hmmm, that good running and presumably blocking with Walker, Newman, Hanson, Rhyan and Nijman for that one series. Have to backtrack a bit on what I wrote. Until Schneider relieves Hanson for the final 7 OC snaps, and Telfort replaces Walker for the final 15 snaps, the OL remains the same.

The next series is Wilson LT for 2, L end for 7, (now Wilson is 6 for 37 yards), Wilson RT for 2, Taylor middle for 2, Wilson middle for minus 1, and punt. Wilson down to 8 for 38.

Yeah, that's better than I thought it was. Wilson does finish the game averaging 4.2 yards per carry.

I also agree that the pass pro was good from the 1s and the 2s. NE pulled their starting DL a few snaps before the 18th snap. So GB's 2s were facing NE backups as well, IIRC.

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greengold's picture

August 20, 2023 at 11:05 am

The Safety thing flipped when Moore went down with the knee injury. I hope it’s not serious. The long looks Savage & Ford got last night might have been amongst their last.

Any of Owens, Johnson Jr. & Sapp III are better players IMO.

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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

August 20, 2023 at 10:15 am

The Patriots played their starting LT, OC and Riley Reiff (RT) for the first two series but Reiff played a total of 31 of a possible 58 snaps. They didn't play either of their starting guards at all. Ferentz, 2nd string at both LG and OC, played 47 snaps. Their 4th string OC played 27 snaps. Their 2nd string LT, RT did not play at all. Their 3rd string
LG and RT each played 31 snaps. Their 3rd string LT played 47 snaps.

So, LT was 1st sting to 11 snaps, and 3rd for all the rest.
LG was 2nd string for 27 snaps, and 3rd string 31 snaps.
OC was 1st string for 11 snaps, 20 for their 2nd string, and 27 snaps 4th string OC.
RG was 2nd string for 27 snaps, 3rd string for 27 snaps, not sure of the other 4.
RT was 1st string Reiff for 31 snaps, and 3rd string for 31. One of them played 4 at RG.

1st string WRs played 17 and 16 snaps. 2nd string WRs played 15 and 3 snaps. Phenom Boute (3rd string but many have him higher played 19 snaps (and caught two passes for 49 yards including a 42 yard TD.

#1 TE Hunter Henry played 16 snaps. 3rd/4th string TE played 33 and 17 snaps respectively. 5th string played 3 snaps. That's about 1 TE per snap.

DL 1s played 15 12, 10 and 9 snaps. DL 2s played 33, 26 and 25 snaps. #3 DLs played 33 and 3.
#1 OLB played 43 and 12 snaps (Judon). #2s played 34 and 30 snaps.

First string CB played 38 and 34 snaps. The 2s played 34, The #1 safeties played 15 and 5 snaps.

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greengold's picture

August 20, 2023 at 10:44 am

This is dynamite, TGR. Thank you for all of it. Really helpful too, being able to reference the ST snaps, as they play a factor into each player’s offerings entirely.

Emanuel Wilson may have picked up more ST snaps had the game not been called early. I love his running style, and I think he’s got athleticism enough to lead block, ala Dorsey Levens, which may put Deguara’s roster spot in jeopardy. I’m looking forward to seeing if they try that next week.

Pearson’s injury might force them to try Wilson there, at FB.

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Coldworld's picture

August 20, 2023 at 10:59 am

Actually, FB would be a waste of Wilson’s athleticism in my view, though it might actually be a good way to fit him and Taylor on the roster. However, I’d get Taylor in at FB/3rd down protector. Taylor is 6’2 and was 217 pounds coming in. We know he’s physical. Pearson hasn’t actually rated well as a blocker: not as well as I expected from casual viewing.

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greengold's picture

August 20, 2023 at 11:14 am

Try it anyway. Hell, we cannot PS Wilson. The Bills already have Dillon on their radar, and they’d snap Wilson up in a heartbeat.

He was clocked at running nearly 22 mph in CIN!!! WE FIND A WAY to keep him. The severely underperforming Deguara jettisoned out allows us to keep both Taylor and Wilson.

WOW!!! I just watched Wilson’s 14 yd run, and MUSGRAVE & KRAFT busted a beautiful hole for Emanuel to run through. Their blocking is impressing the hell outta me, especially Musgrave!!!! Wicks with a nice job blocking downfield too.

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GregC's picture

August 20, 2023 at 11:37 am

Toure returned all of the punts and kickoffs, I think. Nagler mentioned that this could be a sign that Toure is on the bubble, and they are trying to decide whether to keep him on the basis of his ability as a returner. My interpretation is that Toure is going to make the team, and they want him to be the backup returner, so they are giving him as much game experience as possible in that role.

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jhtobias's picture

August 20, 2023 at 02:31 pm

It's preseason but I think a few things are safe to say :

Zack Tom is the best Right Tackle they have and that is his position to lose this yr .
Rasheed Walker has grown up and matured a ton and his audition for swing tackle passed with flying colors .

I'm not sure what is going on , but If i were to guess I'm sure if the the right trade was offered , Yosh would be moved but only because of salary and Bak is untouchable this year. With the emergence of Zack and Rasheed, they are they future at tackles and maybe even Caleb.

Kudos to Sean Ryan he looks not and day from last yr .

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