Prior to 2023, many assumed that young receivers, and especially rookie TEs, wouldn’t be able to contribute too much this season. Holy cow, these kids are exceeding all expectations! I guess it partially their talent & effort and partially due to their QB1’s willingness to throw to all of them, even when they weren’t assignment-sure. Well done to Gute, MLF (even through I’d like to see him go), the WRs/TEs themselves, but, especially to Jordan Love for trusting them.

Take care of the Bears, finishing the season with a winning record, and get a taste of post-season action. Go Pack, Go!

I think we’ve seen enough of a sample size to move on from Barry. The defense stunk against two horrible QBs in important games and finally comes through against an unknown. Barry should be sent packing even if we win the SB.

Sorry - did we play against a rookie first time starter QB - YES - did we let theses Queens walk down the field several times - YES - so I am still not going to let Barry off the hook for getting us in this win or go home game after the Carolina debacle against one of the worse offenses in the league. I am also totally disgusted with the lack of effort on the defense and the fact that early in the season the undisciplined penalties did not result in benching. As far as playing other guys - this has happened all year long given our injuries - and one should expect them to play better later in season as they have been getting a lot of game reps. Finally as I have been posting - Lafleur has proven that he is needed one more year to continue developing Love - win or lose. But he is also the HC - and he needs to bear a big part of the responsibility for the lack of effort and the continue defending of Barry ( and the regression of special teams). I am also of the opinion that the Lafleur was not the Offensive guru that he had been given credit for - but at least has finally adapted to an increase in motion and making the best use of his offensive talent that helped Love deliver rather than standing around in the pocket for too long and eventually forcing passes. BTW I believe that Love's underthrows which led to many of the INT's was because of the pressure to win after missing open guys with overthrows. Such is part of the learning process. In any case - I believe that we cannot be successful next year with Barry - despite this little bit of success.

You have done an excellent job of pointing out the main flaw with Barry. He shows he is capable of designing defensive schemes that can totally shut down an opponent. But he only does this sporadically. All too often, he reverts to very soft coverage calls that result in first downs, or opposing receivers running all alone for easy gains. He holds onto that mindset of "No big plays", and by doing so, allows big plays. The three games with the Giants, Tampa and Carolina showed his weakness. Those are his coffin nails. To be clear, though, I don't hate the guy. I think he should be given the opportunity to resign rather than be fired. And I truly hope he finds a position in the NFL that is more suited to his strengths. But as a DC? He has proven himself incapable of consistently fielding a competitive squad. So, yes, time to move on.

LH, I respect your football acumen; you know that. Any organization should always be analyzing its strengths and weaknesses and looking to improve. Successful organizations are committed to a cycle of continuous improvement that facilitates success. If we look at the length of Barry's tenure, yes, there have been bright spots. but more we've seen much more inconsistency, and yes, incompetence in scheme and lack of situational awareness.

For me, it boils down the question of if the Packers could find a DC better than the one they have now. That answer is yes, even if Joe somehow manages not to trip on his dick or anything else to hand a victory to the Bears on Sunday.

The win over the Vikings was a win over a team that has lost 5 of their last 6 games, lead by two awful QBs, and a coach who appears to have lost his critical thinking skills. The Packers and MLF have treated JB with a great deal of grace by allowing him to finish the season. Here's a thought: if the Packers lovingly set Joe free at the end of his current contract, would any of our North Division rivals bring him on a a consultant? I think that's a nope, nope, nope.

Barry has proven already he needs to go regardless of these final games .

I agree that the defense has played good games but the inconsistency has always been a problem with Berry. Not sure if he just does not know what to do to defend against certain offenses or does he just not prepare enough.

We need constancy on both sides of the ball.

Leatherhead- I admire people who speak the facts regardless of what the mob is chanting. The mob isn't always right.

It will be a tough call for MLF during the off season. His friend didn't put together a winning defense. But the mob also can't forget that defense won the Detroit and Kansas City games. Part of the defensive problem is personnel. Some of the folks we think are good really aren't in the grand scheme of things.
But what is remarkable is a Pro Bowl corner and a hot prospect at the other corner have either been gone or f-ing up all season. Two unknowns have stepped in and did well. You have to count that. Gute left a big hole at safety(wouldn't Brian Branch look good in Green and Gold?)
He also unloaded Douglas who has done very well in Buffalo.

There are great reasons to let Barry go. There are also reasons to keep him. Thus a tough call for MLF. But I always harken back to the 'fire everybody' crowd: the next person hired won't always succeed. In fact, they could be worse.

Leatherhead,
You ARE kidding, right?
Beating a downtrodden Vikings team without a quality QB and a shitload of injuries does NOT forgive all the horseshit games the "D" has played over the past 3 years. Call Detroit and ask their fans if they've forgotten 0-16.
If Barry is here at this time next year, we'll all be 5 years older with more gray (or less) hair, and talking about the "What If's" again!

There are 5 games this season where Jordan Love and the Offense gave the team a lead late in the game...only for Barry Ball to give it back and lose the game.

The key to the defense on Sunday was Barry (finally) dealing up front seven pressure a few times. A turnover. And most importantly, the Offense chewing clock on long scoring drives keeping Barry Ball off the field. The O had 70 plays to the D having to defend just 50.

Again, it is not the "points" with Barry Ball, it is when he gives them up. His philosophy is one of playing not to lose...then his philosophy usually losses anyway. There is NO vision of dominance for his charges...just play the prevent (the win) soft zone and protect the yards behind you, but don't attempt to take the ground in front of you!

The Defense has talent...Barry even used it a few times with front 7 pressure. Was that Quay Walker getting home on a blitz? Be still my beating heart! Nixon on a blitz. What was that? Then it was gone.

The Packers' D players deserve better.

There is no universe in which Joe Berry is an NFL level DC. The final four games of last season were given as a sorry excuse for keeping JB. What it really was was his contract expires after this season. No need to fire him, just don't re-sign him. There are 20 people available to fill the position, all of them better.

In a 32 team league, about half the teams are average-ish. 8 a little above, 8 a little below. Packers fall squarely in that range, especially on points, where they've consistently been in that 12-20 range. Half of their opponents do not get past 20 points.

I couldn't make a judgement like that based on a couple of short shots of Barry in the box.

Dude....we crushed the Vikings. Can't you give him any credit for that ?

Championships are not won with a good defense. Championships are won with offense. People that believe that defense wins championships are only looking at championship[ team that had good defenses and above average to very good offenses.

I bet you cannot name more than 5 Super Bowl winners that had a better defense than offense.

Defense keeps you in the game and provide opportunities for the offense to win the game. Yes a good defense is needed but you need both.

"For those...thankfully very few at this point...who are still defending Barry....let me ask you a simple question. When/if he is unemployed this offseason, how many teams do you envision will be lining up to hire him as their DC?"

Yeah, just posted a similar question in response go LH above before seeing your question here. To my knowledge, no teams requested to interview JB last off-season.

0 - I mean ZERO

I would be dumbfounded if even 1 NFL team, outside of GB, would want Barry as it's DC. His lack of success is backed up statistically over too many seasons.

Looking for games in which JB did well, which of the 8 losses this season would you point to? The 9 last season? I'm not pinning all 17 on JB, I'm just asking which of those did he do well in?

Against the Viqueens, it was the perfect situation for Barry ball to work. You can't just wait for opponents to adjust to your scheme.

Rodgers’ would’ve left those shiny new toys unused for a couple of seasons. Either that, or he’d give them the old stink-eye when they failed to divine the special (uncalled) route that Rodgers was thinking at the moment.

You're exactly Right.
Thank You for speaking up.

And there have certainly been highly drafted players who were better than anyone thought. ANYBODY! Ya know Green Bay isn’t the only team that missed on Hurts.

OP should watch and follow some other franchises before he judges this one

Year Six, where's the gold?

AR was done after 2012 and it was all downhill from there. On and even more off the field.
He was all about him self and the couple of buddies he needed for his entertainment. He refused to throw to anyone he did not like and called it „trust issues“. He das low morals and his passiv aggressiv nonsense was hard to watch. He was a coward who sucked the joy out of football. Had more weapons than most other QBs over his carrer and made nothing out of it. He always lost wehn it counts and played like 5% oft he SC but earnd 30%. But is was never his fault. So he throw everyone else under the bus. Most oft he time not directly of course. He was a coward and Lombardi would have thrown him out in 2013. Got lucky MLF fixed him somehow and got him 2 MVPs.
Off the field he got total crazy from Chemtrials, to Dolphine sex to Ivermetin abuse. He hates common sense and moral and thinks he ist o smart to realise how dumb he really is. But what would you expect from a guy who asked Rogan for advice. Let sink that in…..
Great we got the joy of football back and I can even my kids let watch again. Kelce is much smarter and stronger in his little finger than AR ever was.

I would be disappointed, but not surprised.

You can get a lot done in an off-season! And the second year leap is a real thing, for some already pretty impactful players. You know the list. Plus we’re going to get a good draft in. Ofc there are areas to bolster. There always are. With every team. I trust Gutey to get it done. This is his baby! Gotta think Murphy would love a SB before his Draft. Aka his Swan Song.

Haha. Some one gave a 👎. Idiot hater

The old practice of bringing in a QB every 2 or 3 years was a good one. It’s one I’d like us to get back to. However, having added Clifford last year, 2024 is a year I don’t think we should.

This year we need to focus on IOL and the secondary, and adjusting to the needs of a new DC who is hopefully less focused on bending and trying not to break. After that, it’s RB and depth.

Refilling the pipelines is not just important at QB. The last couple of drafts have given us the chance to have a deep as well as good roster with the picks accumulated. QB can wait a year.

The argument isn't really "should we draft and develop a QB when we don't need one now". My problem is the execution of the decision. Love would certainly been available later in the draft and the top pick could have been used on a receiver or a back.

There may have been bad blood between Rodgers and the GM prior to the draft, but the way it was handled just made things worse. Rodgers had built enough capital with the organization that he deserved a little more respect at that time. Just my opinion.

I thought they'd go 12 and 5. or at least 11-6. I thought they'd win the division. They should have.

I also thought Bakhtiari would be the player he's paid to be, so too Jaire. Injuries scuttled most of Jones season too.

You have repeatedly proved that you don't know what you're looking at. Whether it was your initial dismissal of Aaron Rodgers when he replaced Favre, or your obvious miss regarding Love, you just don't see it or understand it until it's in your rearview mirror.

because in two weeks, we are playing on house money.

This is exactly the kind of over confidence that scares me re: the Bears game.

Not sure about nothing but fun for the next 2 weeks? How about concentrating on the Bears this Sunday. Then, and only then, should we think about the playoff " fun we might have with "house money"

again, who is this "us/we" you are referring to?

you're a viking fan.

AR was done after 2012 and it was all downhill from there. On and even more off the field.
He was all about him self and the couple of buddies he needed for his entertainment. He refused to throw to anyone he did not like and called it „trust issues“. He das low morals and his passiv aggressiv nonsense was hard to watch. He was a coward who sucked the joy out of football. Had more weapons than most other QBs over his carrer and made nothing out of it. He always lost wehn it counts and played like 5% oft he SC but earnd 30%. But is was never his fault. So he throw everyone else under the bus. Most oft he time not directly of course. He was a coward and Lombardi would have thrown him out in 2013. Got lucky MLF fixed him somehow and got him 2 MVPs.
Off the field he got total crazy from Chemtrials, to Dolphine sex to Ivermetin abuse. He hates common sense and moral and thinks he ist o smart to realise how dumb he really is. But what would you expect from a guy who asked Rogan for advice. Let sink that in…..
Great we got the joy of football back and I can even my kids let watch again. Kelce is much smarter and stronger in his little finger than AR ever was.

Walker was a very effective blitzer in college. It was great to see him show why when given a chance.

The fear with Jones as with any running back is not just that his body looses that twitch due to age, but how often he can be healthy and out there. He’s not lost his twitch, he’s not that old and hasn’t had a vast workload, but is the ability to do than 10-15 times a season, let alone post season, still there? Impossible to know. That’s the conundrum for the team.

Agree. The frustrating thing is how ineffective Dillon appears to be in goal line situations. Would be a different story if he wasn't all that explosive, but could convert 3rd and 2s frequently. Now, that's probably as much an o-line issue as a Dillon issue, but still, he just seems very replaceable and I certainly wouldn't give Dillon another contract that pays anything more than what a rookie would make.

I believe Jones has 2-3 more really good years left. Obviously it can go fast, but he really hasn't had a huge workload over the years. I would prefer to keep him another year or 2.

What I want to see though, is them getting some more speed and explosiveness at RB. I like Dillon and he is a good backup RB. But when Jones is out of the lineup the lack of explosiveness at RB is telling. Wilson has speed and unfortunately got hurt when he was really starting to emerge. But I believe they need to find 1-2 RB's in the draft. I want them to have shiftiness and speed.

BPA for sure. But I'm not sure this team is out of cap trouble. If I go and look at 2025 or 2026 cap numbers, I see GB as being in the bottom 25% of teams in available dollars - and that's before a Love contract. Lot of money to JA, Gary, Preston and Campbell that are going to keep the belt tight

Are you saying Russel Wilson wasn’t the answer? 😉

As much as I think Gute ended up swinging a good deal from the Jets for AR, the haul we would have gotten from Denver had we traded Rodgers coming off the 2021 MVP campaign would have made the Vikings-Herschel Walker trade look like small potatoes. The '22 season would have been much worse than 9-8, but the team would be set up for dominance for the next decade.

Yes, we were a year too late. To be more precise, Murphy was a year too late. He championed a 100 million extension, predicted a 4th MVP post Adams at the time. Still cost us 40 million in cap this season even after unwinding it.

It was pretty hard to swallow your theory then that Gute drove the decision to keep him. Gute in fact said almost nothing as that deal was concluded. Murphy led the charge “we are not idiots” with cheerleading from LaFleur. It looks even less plausible now, after it was unwound and we went all out youth a year later to build around Love.

I believe they would have made the trade if they felt Love was ready. I don't believe they felt he was ready to be the guy last year.

One thing we should agree with is that starting a QB too soon can do more harm then good. Look at how many QB's play way before they should, and how bad their careers turn out because of it.
I think back to last year and Malik Willis. He was a guy who has some very natural talents. But he was raw coming into the NFL and needed a year or 2 of development. Well they played him and he wasn't good and then they drafted another QB to be the guy. Some guys just need time to develop.

Obviously we don't know how Love would have done had he started last year as the QB. And we don't know where he would be now with his development had he gotten that time last year. But right now we have to definitely like where Love is at compared to where he was to start the year. I will just say I like how the Packers take time to develop the QB and make sure he is ready before they put the franchise on his shoulders.

That would presume that Love was ready a year earlier. I would say that the actions of the front office strongly suggest that they felt the club was better off with Rodgers, even with the financial constraints. And of course, we would have had more high draft picks but draft picks don't always work out, even high ones.

Gute/LaFleur have put 5 teams on the field. They've won a higher percentage of games during that time than any other team, and LaFleur has one of the highest win percentages of all time.

We've made the playoffs 4 out 5. We have extra picks at the top of the draft, again. We have a young, ascending team. Maybe he was one year too late on Rodgers, maybe not, but we're in a real good spot.

To me, the most damning thing MLF said was the d was “making mistakes on day 1 installs”.
I took that to mean JB and staff never taught the stuff effectively. Crappy calls or not, mistakes will ruin ANY defense.

Sounds like the next DC needs to be an alpha, not only for these players but for MLF too. Need somebody in there that demands respect and sets the tone.

Boneman, you are correct about magic not solving problems.

Right now, here's what our DC is going to start with on March 1:

5 good DL in Clark, Wyatt, Slaton, Brooks , Wooden.
Van Ness, Gary, Enagbare. Maybe Smith. That's good outside pressure.
Walker.
Alexander, Stokes, Valentine, Nixon, Johnson, Ballentine.....

Even with two more good DBs and excellent health and different coaching and schemes......we're still going to be short of what we need, IMO.

I thought the line would be 4 or 4.5 with home field but the Bears have won 4 of 5 with the lone loss coming to a good Cleveland team 17-20. They also have been in every game since they played the Chargers in October.

If the Packers aren't ready to play a physical game and take the Bears best shot it will be a rewind of last year's Lions game. This is the Bears SB.

Didn’t the pay love 20 mil, 2 yr already?Wasn’t that the deal this year? If so, won’t have to worry about paying him until 2025 before camp. And by then we’ll know what we have.

The conversation is always nuanced.

Have to incorporate the fact that $55M of salary cap is to guys that aren't playing on this team, along with another $25M to 69 and Stokes to basically not play this year. $80M of the $220M cap eaten up by what essentially amounts to a necessary rebuild year.

Throw in the injuries to Jaire, Jones and Campbell and this team has, at times, been playing with the equivalent of an Oakland Athletics budget.

Should they have beat the Giants? Yes. Should they be embarrassed to give up 30 points to the Panthers? Absolutely. Get a new DC? Of course.

But just because Love was picked in the first round doesn't mean he was a guaranteed stud, and for this offense to play this well at this age and experience level is tremendous. And that's likely on coaching as much as anything. Lots of success stories sprinkled in with some not so great coaching on the defensive side.

It was not MLF los the years befor it was mostly on the grumpy fellaw, who always lost when it counts.

AR was done after 2012 and it was all downhill from there. On and even more off the field.
He was all about him self and the couple of buddies he needed for his entertainment. He refused to throw to anyone he did not like and called it „trust issues“. He das low morals and his passiv aggressiv nonsense was hard to watch. He was a coward who sucked the joy out of football. Had more weapons than most other QBs over his carrer and made nothing out of it. He always lost wehn it counts and played like 5% oft he SC but earnd 30%. But is was never his fault. So he throw everyone else under the bus. Most oft he time not directly of course. He was a coward and Lombardi would have thrown him out in 2013. Got lucky MLF fixed him somehow and got him 2 MVPs.
Off the field he got total crazy from Chemtrials, to Dolphine sex to Ivermetin abuse. He hates common sense and moral and thinks he ist o smart to realise how dumb he really is. But what would you expect from a guy who asked Rogan for advice. Let sink that in…..
Great we got the joy of football back and I can even my kids let watch again. Kelce is much smarter and stronger in his little finger than AR ever was.

Trading Ja saves $3MM and leaves a cap hit of $24MM next year. Stokes is cheap. Giving away all your best players is not a winning strategy. Neither is playing them 85% of the snaps after coming back from extended injury, which is what GB did.

The Giants game, halftime adjustments were made. DeVito had answers for everything JB tried. He got outcoached.

Trading #9 would be stupid, he's a big upgrade over MVS. He doesn't cost much and is well worth a roster spot. He might even be good for more than 4 games next season. The biggest problem is JL10 trying to adjust to his speed, which is yet another reason Bo Melton should be used in the MVS role when #9 is out. Melton is even faster, and JL can maintain that connection.