Cory's Corner: Bring Tonyan Back

Don't underestimate this tight end's heart. 

It’s time to believe in Robert Tonyan.

The Packers tight end played last year on a one-year deal after tearing his ACL on Oct. 28, 2021. He was placed on the Physically Unable to Perform list to start training camp and came off of it on Aug. 14.

“It’s been a long process,” said Tonyan back in August. “I was just kind of feeling a little out of the football loop for a little bit. So, to get back in there, running plays and lining up next to people and being in the huddle again was just a positive on my life in general.”

An ACL tear generally takes two years to come back to full strength. I was even surprised to see Tonyan come back from the PUP list so quickly. 

And yet, Tonyan played 17 games and he tallied his best catch percentage since 2020. Granted, he didn’t have the burst that we have been used to seeing, especially down the seam. He only had four games where he caught more than three balls, including a 10-catch 90-yard performance against the Jets. 

Tonyan, who turns 29 in April, is no fool. He knows that tight end is a desperate need for the Packers and he also knows that this will be a prove-it year for himself. He will be more than happy to sign another one-year deal with the hopes of turning that gamble into dollar signs by next offseason. 

No matter what happens at the quarterback position, Tonyan should find himself as a Packer next year. He knows and understands the offense, he is a solid receiver and is a capable blocker. 

Just because the Packers could potentially get a solid tight end at No. 15 shouldn’t stop them from bringing Tonyan back. The more offensive weapons, the better. Not to mention, a rookie tight end wouldn’t be getting a large role right away. 

But if anything, bringing Tonyan back just gives the Packers more options. If they wanted to go after more depth in the secondary or at wideout, that would also make sense. 

Tonyan has been overlooked his entire career, which includes a college stint at the less heralded Indiana State. He would love to prove even more people wrong just by coming back and catching a half dozen touchdowns. 

The only thing that teams cannot measure is a player’s heart. Ironically enough, the Underwear Olympics are now underway in Indianapolis. Teams descend on the Circle City to measure every aspect of a player — height, weight, speed, strength, catching ability and mental processing.

The Packers have seen Tonyan’s heart and know what makes it tick. That gives them an advantage over other teams.

Tonyan showed up at Indiana State as a quarterback, left as a wideout and ended up as a tight end in the pros. If you don’t think that Tonyan will do whatever it takes to play and play well, you haven’t been paying attention. 

 

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__________________________

Cory Jennerjohn is a graduate from UW-Oshkosh and has been in sports media for over 15 years. He was a co-host on "Clubhouse Live" and has also done various radio and TV work as well. He has written for newspapers, magazines and websites. He currently is a columnist for CHTV and also does various podcasts. He recently earned his Masters degree from the University of Iowa. He can be found on Twitter: @Coryjennerjohn

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NFL Categories: 
10 points
 

Comments (81)

Fan-Friendly This filter will hide comments which have ratio of 5 to 1 down-vote to up-vote.
Johnblood27's picture

February 28, 2023 at 06:28 am

I am OK with Tonyan coming back...

IF - the numbers work out, I would not overpay, remember what he has done, not what he may do.

IF - Davis is GONE, this is the guy who needs to be replaced.

IF - Lewis commits himself to upgrading his impact, the GBP roster isnt a placeholder for the AARP, the NFL is a performance based workplace, not a gub-mint J-O-B.

IF - the team commits to one talented youngster to learn from Davis's former roster spot and has one more in waiting on the PS. No need to keep bringing retreads if there is no plan for the future.

OR... just because AR says so...

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splitpea1's picture

February 28, 2023 at 11:07 am

No! Get younger, get better, and for once, get serious about this position. I don't know if Lewis returns, but we need two new faces, one of them being a franchise type who can be developed into an all-purpose weapon. I'm sick and tired of just trying to get by here with temporary or stopgap solutions.

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T7Steve's picture

February 28, 2023 at 06:32 am

I wish we could get all the players back and hit on all the draft choices. Wish in one hand.......

That's the second or third 1 year prove it deal Tonyan has worked on. It's amazing how well those work out, and I wish all players could be working in a contract year. Guaranteed money has changed the game. Good for the players, not so good for the sport.

I wish I could have a guaranteed job, no matter if I did it or not.

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stockholder's picture

February 28, 2023 at 06:43 am

This guy is a Green Bay Packer.
He's matured and is a good Te.
With Tonyan you get exactly what you see.
And he should be brought back.
Tonyan knows the offense.
There is No waiting game.
There is No give him/wait 3 years.
There is No BUST.
It's pay me, and I'll give you what you paid for.
It's one less mistake Gutey could make.

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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:49 am

Tonyan is 29 and doesn’t have much blocking value. We are already tight cap wise, and we don’t have the space to bring back an average TE for 5m. Look to the draft.

If what we really want is a veteran stopgap, then just bring back Lewis. He will be much cheaper

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Coldworld's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:23 am

Lewis is a completely different player. He’s essentially an extra OL who leaks out and catches occasional passes. He’s there simply because he’s still one of the best in line TE blockers around and cheap as well. If he comes back or not, I see little relevance to the question about whether Tonyan should.

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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:26 am

Well stated!

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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:48 am

I think the Packers will be in the market for at least one, if not two, TEs this off-season. The Packers could bring back Tonyan to be that "F" TE as one of those two (or as a supplement to the WR room). I'm skeptical that Deguara will turn into very much, but he could blossom, yet, which means he could fill that role, instead. I'd be looking for a replacement.

I see a lot of overlap in what Lazard did and what Tonyan did/does which creates an opening for him if the price is right--he'll come much cheaper than Lazard. Both are sticky-handed possession/security blanket guys in a lot of what they're asked to do. Tonyan's not going to play with his hand on the ground and isn't to drive block on DEs and big OLBs in the run game, but he can dominate DBs and smaller LBs and run the underneath stuff competently. Tonyan won't be a regular downfield receiving threat (really, Lazard wasn't either), but he'll get downfield on occasion and the Packers have other guys in the WR better suited to that role.

Overall, this team hasn't shown any real investment in using the TE position creatively for ages, and am optimistic that it could grow with a different starting QB. A one, or two-year deal with low guarantees might be appropriate and allow the Packers to hold down the fort--diminish the need to reach on a high draft pick and instead look for an opportunity-- while they try to find or develop a higher-end talent.

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jannes bjornson's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:55 am

Use the money to make a play on Jamel Dean opposite Jaire. Thornhill, or Vonn Bell at safety. Gesicki is the target if you want a younger veteran TE.

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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:25 am

Gesicki had a falling-out in Miami (so teams will want to know if he's a malcontent) when Waddle and Hill were getting all the attention and he was passed up on the depth chart by a guy who actually blocks, but he's productive and runs well. Someone will shell out big bucks for him.

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jannes bjornson's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:53 am

He didn't care for the Shanahan offense. McDaniel didn't use him enough.

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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:59 am

Agreed--McDaniel needed a guy who was at least a little interested in blocking, and they had high-end, speedy targets at WR, so his snaps suffered. I read some reports that he was pissed off about the franchise tag and was a locker-room issue.

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jannes bjornson's picture

February 28, 2023 at 03:07 pm

He's nobody's fool.

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Titletown222's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:24 pm

Gesickis inability to blockwas a huge problem in Miami. Same issue for GB. He would likely only play 25-35% of offensive snaps.

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golfpacker1's picture

March 03, 2023 at 06:59 pm

Ah, hindsight is my middle name. I really wanted the Packers to draft Juan Thornhill in 2019. He was my saftey crush along with the guy the Chargers picked, Nasir Adderly. We instead traded up in the 1st round for Savage and now he doesn't see the field. And wasted both 4th round picks in the trade. The Chiefs swooped Thornhill up with the 63rd pick and the rest is history. These draft gods aren't as great as they and we think they are. Gary was a big win and Savage not so good. I would see if we could trade Savage strait up for the Broncos TE Albert Okwuegbunem instead of paying Tonyan 5 or 6 million. Keep if if its 2 million. Albert O was a mid round pick in 2020 for Denver. Ran 4.5 40 at the combine. Denver has wasted his talent with no good QB to throw to him. When the Broncos wanted Rodgers, Albert was a player we wanted in the deal. Wow what a deal we missed there dumping the Diva for that haul.

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Handsback's picture

February 28, 2023 at 06:44 am

Seems like a no-brainer to bring him back. Last few games of the season he looked faster. Could be wrong, but he's better than nothing which is what they have now for downfield threats.

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RCPackerFan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:31 am

The numbers would also match what you saw too.

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Packer_Fan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:08 am

The Packers should take a good long look at other FA TE's. Tonyan 's age is against him. He has lost a step and he has this habit of stopping when he has the ball. Robert, just keep running forward!

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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:48 am

Just don’t sign any free agents, period. Look to the draft.

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jannes bjornson's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:23 am

There are three guys in the draft that can fill his spot and not lose production. Move on and move on from Lewis. Davis is good value for his spot. He was improving. Tonyan did not look any faster as the season progressed. They need the quick twitch guy to get to the hook zones fast on short yardage.

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RCPackerFan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:08 am

Tonyan finished the season with 53 catches, 470 yards and 2 TD's. His longest reception was 24 yards which came in week 17. He had 2 of his 5 longest receptions in the final 2 games of the season. He also had his highest average per catch in the final 2 weeks. To me it seemed like Tonyan was starting to feel better/get better at the end of the season. The final 2 games he had 6 receptions for 81 yards, 13.5 average and 1 TD. To stretch it out a bit more the final 4 games he averaged 12.25 yards per catch. For the season he averaged 8.9 yards per catch.

Tonyan's best year was 2020 when he had 52 catches for 586 yards, 11.3 average and 11 TD's. In 21 he also averaged 11.3 yards per catch.

What this tells me is that bringing Tonyan back would be a wise decision. He was getting healthier and better as the season wore on. He is the best pass catching TE on the roster. This is a good draft class for TE's but it takes TE's a while to make an impact. So bringing Tonyan back makes the most sense, and they would be wise to draft a TE also. Deguara provides a really good option as a FB/H-back type of player. They need someone else that can be a field stretching type of TE. But Tonyan would provide the biggest impact on the offense this year.

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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:48 am

Tonyan is 29. We need to get younger. We are already pressed for cap space, and the TE class in this draft is excellent. Why would we bring back Tonyan for a season that, most likely, won’t go anywhere significant?

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RCPackerFan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:10 am

"for a season that, most likely, won’t go anywhere significant"

So basically we might as well throw the towel in already?
Sorry I'm not geared that way. I believe we are a couple of players away from making a serious Super Bowl run. Brining Tonyan back and pairing him with a rookie TE gives us what we need for now and the future.

Rookie TE's typically don't have a big impact. On average it seems to take until their 3rd year to make a splash. Tonyan's first year he had 4 catches for 77 yards 1 TD. His 3rd year he had 52 catches 586 yards and 11 TD's.

Here are some other top TE's drafted and the numbers they put up in their rookie year compared to their 3rd year (2nd year for a few).

2018:
Hayden Hurst - Rookie year 13 rec, 163 yards, 1 TD. Year 3- 56 rec, 571 yards, 6 TD
Mike Gesicki - Rookie year 22 rec, 202 yards, 0 TD. Year 3- 53 rec 703 yards, 6 TD
Dallas Goedert - Rookie year 33 rec, 334 yards, 4 TD. Year 3- 46 rec 524 yards, 3 TD
Mark Andrews - Rookie year 34 rec, 552 yards, 3 TD. Year 3- 58 rec 701 yards, 1 TD.

2019:
TJ Hockenson- Rookie year - 32 rec, 367 yards, 2 TD. Year 3- 61 rec, 583 yards, 4 TD
Noah Fant- Rookie year - 40 rec, 562 yards, 3 TD. Year 3- 68 rec, 670 yards, 4 TD

2020:
Cole Kmet - Rookie year - 28 rec, 243 yards, 2TD. Year 3- 50 rec, 544 yards, 7 TD

2021:
Kyle Pitts - Rookie year - 68 rec, 1026 yards, 1 TD. Year 2 - 28 rec, 356 yards, 2 TD

2022:
Tre McBride - 29 rec, 265 yards, 1 TD
Jelani Woods - 25 rec, 312 yards, 3 TD

The point of me going through the last 5 years and choosing the top few TE's drafted and putting up their numbers in year 1 compared to year 2 or 3, is to show what they do as a rookie compared to their next few years. The only TE that really stood out in their rookie year was Kyle Pitts. Otherwise the other 9 Rookie TE's averaged 28 catches, 333 yards, 2 TD's.
You can't expect a rookie TE to come in and light it up. That is why they need to resign Tonyan, and allow the rookie time to develop.

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MainePackFan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:42 am

I agree with you RC. Too many people sticking a fork in the Packers for 2023. Tonyan can still be an asset for this team.

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RCPackerFan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 10:04 am

I just don't get the idea of giving up on a season when they haven't even had free agency, or the draft yet.

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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 01:46 pm

Have you seen the way the Packers are approaching this season (and the seasons past)? They are passive in free agency (don’t expect much, if anything, there) and what I understand from the FO is that they want to restructure everybody and bring back the band for another run in 2023.

What (besides the QB potentially) will be different that will make 2023 go so much better than our 8-9 2022 season? We are losing Lazard in FA, there is a gaping hole at safety and TE, Myers is a massive question mark, Stokes and Gary won’t be back until 2/3rds of the way through the 2023 season and Smith and Campbell are getting older. Oh, also, not to mention that we still have Joe Barry as our DC and Matt LaFleur as our HC, and Jerry Gray left too.

If anything, 2023 is looking to be worse than 2022. Even if Rodgers returns, he is aging, and it is unfair to expect him to carry the team in 2023 the way he did in years past. I don’t think that is possible for him to do in his age 40 season, and that is why, whether it’s Rodgers or Love, we wont be going anywhere fast in 2023.

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golfpacker1's picture

March 04, 2023 at 12:28 pm

I agree we need to draft multiple tight ends but the reality is we will probaby only have 2 or 3 shots at the top ten in the draft. Still I think 15 is too high but trading back and selecting one late 1st or early 2nd probably still has 3 or 4 of the top 5 still available. Plus we score extra picks and then we can fill the bigger needs we have. If Tonyan would resign for $2 million a year I wouldn't hesitate, but 3 to 6 million is too much. Other than scoring TDs he had a decent year. But then Green Bay didn't score much at all last year. Mayer will be gone in 1st round. I think if it fell our way I would take Washington or Kinkaid 1st. Then later 3rd,4th,5th, I take Kuntz, Whyle, Latu. Later option I like Camren Mcdonald-FSU, Payne-Purdue. Sleeper is Kemari Averett-Bethune Cookman. What do you think about trading for Broncos Albert O ?
Probably could get him for a 7th rounder or trade Savage for him and ? He probably is better than anyone we had last year.

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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:53 am

I think that Watson and Jones were garnering a lot of attention from opposing DCs in the passing game, and that started to open things up for Tonyan at the end of the year. I agree that it could also be his knee was rounding into shape, too.

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RCPackerFan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:44 am

Tonyan clearly was lacking elusiveness and explosiveness. He seemed to be getting some of it back at the end of the year.

I do believe next year he will be better.
Add that to the development of Watson and Doubs, the much improved OL, and our offense will be much better!

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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:48 am

We lose sight of the fact that he was back playing week 1 after suffering an ACL around Nov. 1 the previous year. That's a pretty rapid return.

He didn't look dynamic--and, admittedly, didn't seem to look nearly as dynamic in 2021 as he did in 2020, either--but I think that's to be expected. I don't know that he'll be markedly better (age and all) but I don't think he'll be worse.

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RCPackerFan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:59 am

Exactly. It takes players time at times.

Tonyan in 2021 averaged the same yards per catch as he did in 2020 (11.3 ave). But he only played half the season.

I'm not saying we need to sign Tonyan to a monster contract or anything. But if the price is right. I say go and resign him. Because he should be better then last year. And if they were to draft a TE it allows that guy time to develop.

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Tundraboy's picture

February 28, 2023 at 11:17 pm

Finally a sane, and correct comment Thank you

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golfpacker1's picture

March 03, 2023 at 07:13 pm

Tonyan also has had another off season to make that knee stronger. His stats were about the same as before the injury, just TD's were way down. That is probably Rodgers and the coaching staffs fault more than Tonyans. How bad was our red zone offence last year? Thats on Rodgers. Good teams score touchdowns not kick field goals. God how many times did we waste timeouts because Diva didn't get the play off in time. Tonyan would be worth it for 2 to 3 million. Trade Rodgers and Bakh and resign Tonyan.

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NickPerry's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:14 am

I'm all for bringing Big Bobby back but I sure as hell wouldn't give him too much money. Spotrac has him projected at $5.1 million. Somehow that seems too rich for Tonyan but I guess everything does at 1265 Lombardi. Perhaps a smaller guarantee with incentives will be the way to bring him back. He just seemed to lose quite a bit of his speed last season and at 29 in April there's no promise it will be better.

My hope is and it will remain my hope is the Packers pick up an additional 1st in a trade for Rodgers. Draft an Edge or WR with the Jets 13th pick, and then maybe pick up additional picks like they did in 2018 by trading #15 and moving to the back of the first round. I wouldn't have a problem drafting a TE at say for example 26 or 27. Having that pick would be a luxury, especially with the additional picks for moving back. Maybe another 1st in 2024 like he did in 2018. Then you could take a Kincaid or Meyers if either are available or maybe you shore up safety.

My point is bringing Tonyan back isn't a bad idea as long as it's affordable, AND they draft another TE by the end of the 2nd round. Hell, trade your 3rd for the next 2 years to go back up to the 2nd round if needed to get THAT guy at TE since we all KNOW the 3rd rounder by the Packers will be somewhere else OTHER than GB by year 3.

2 points
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T7Steve's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:30 am

Yes, bring him back. I like Lewis too, but it doesn't make any sense to have a TE that only blocks. I'd rather have a tackle eligible who would actually block better, and still require a LB to keep him honest.

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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:46 am

I don’t see any point in bringing him back. He is 29. Even a contract worth 3m will still be pressing our cap tightly (assuming Nixon and Ford return and Gary is extended).

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jannes bjornson's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:38 am

That is part of the equation. If he is re-signed, is it another one-year deal? He may not be in favor of playing short term unless he gets paid more. His production picked up, but he gained his yards as a third option working under coverage, or along the sideline. He has the hands. Does he have any burst left?

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SicSemperTyrannis's picture

February 28, 2023 at 05:41 pm

Agreed that #1 pick should be an edge rusher if a real difference maker is available. Should be able to get Bobby cheap and his leadership value at the position is worth at least as much as his production.

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golfpacker1's picture

March 03, 2023 at 07:25 pm

I agree Nick. Trading back is the key to aceing this draft. Score more 2nd, 3rd, and 4th round picks where there is all kinds of talent available and we can fill most of our needs through the draft. Free agency is to fill the bigger holes and it costs way more. Trade Rodgers, Bahk, Savage,etc. Then move back with both 1st round picks to get more shots at the prize, kill the draft and a few key free agents (saftey,TE). Sounds easy.

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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:44 am

Why? He is 29, averaged under 9 YPC (terrible for a TE), had just 470 receiving yards, and isn’t a good blocker. We don’t need to sacrifice an extra 5m of cap space when we are already going to be super tight cap wise just to bring back an average (or below) TE. Especially not when the TE class in this years draft is excellent.

We need to get a real, younger solution at the TE position. Instead of throwing cap money at some second or third rate free agent, let’s take advantage of the TE class and draft a real solution. Mayer, Kincaid, Musgrave, Washington, or Kraft please.

As much as I do like Tonyan, football management is more like a business. Even though Tonyan is a great Packer, we need to know when it is time to move on. I don’t think having an average TE Tonyan is worth 5m/yr in a rebuilding season, especially when the cap is tight.

5 points
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golfpacker1's picture

March 03, 2023 at 07:39 pm

I agree no to Tonyan @ $5 million a year. But @ 2 or 3 millions a year he is worth that. If he has that many catches with 6 TDs he probably gets 8 to 10 million from someone. His knee will also be stronger with another off season. Regardless we need one of the top 5 TE you mentions plus maybe a Laporta-iowa, Whyle-Cinn, Kuntz-ODU or ? We also have 2021 Big Ten tight end of the year on our practice squad, Austin Allen. Watched him play against Iowa and he was decent. He would be a big red zone talent at 6'8 260lbs.

1 points
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greengold's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:45 am

It’s going to be interesting seeing who returns to play with whom.

Tonyan being re-signed to GB on a cap friendly deal fits Gutekunst’s MO of bolstering a draft need position with a FA signing prior to Draft Day 1.

Tonyan wanting to remain in GB is good for the Packers. ACLs aren’t the career enders they used to be. Year 2 out of surgery ought to give us a better player to sign, and scheme ready.

4 points
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marpag1's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:49 am

Don't much care about his "heart."

In my opinion he's a very ordinary player. If we can get him for a very ordinary player's salary, I'm OK with it. Or not... that's fine, too.

3 points
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greengold's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:58 am

Tonyan wasn’t ordinary prior to his ACL, tying Kelce with 11 TDs leading the NFL, in roughly 1/3 the targets/receptions.

4 points
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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:04 am

2020 looks like an outlier. In 2021, prior to his ACL tear, his stats were those of an average TE

5 points
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RCPackerFan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 10:28 am

He was averaging 11.3 yards per catch, the exact same average he had in 2020.

Here is a comparison to some of the other top TE's in the league.

Kelce - 11.4 average.
Kittle - 13.1 average.
Andrews - 13.2 average.
Hockenson - 10.5 average.
Shultz - 10.06 average.
Knox - 11.95 average.

Tonyan in those 2 years put up the same type of average as those other guys.

1 points
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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 01:48 pm

How many receptions, yards, and TDs did he have in 2021 prior to his injury? We’re they on pace with his 2020 stats?

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marpag1's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:13 am

Yes, his production was quite good that year, but in my mind everything about that year just screams fluke. The numbers are so far out of line, not only compared to his other seasons, but even compared to other good players, that I find it exceedingly unlikely that he will ever come close to replicating them. But my biggest argument is simply that I've watched him play, and he doesn't seem particularly good at gaining separation, etc. Sometimes average players have big numbers. And he totally sucks as a blocker.

After his good year 2020, in In the 8 games PRIOR to blowing out his knee in 2021, why did Tonyan have only 200 yards and 2 TDs?? That seems.... ordinary. At best.

3 points
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The_Baloney_Stops_Here's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:34 am

That is what we call an outlier. Never chase outliers.

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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:55 am

The TDs were an outlier, but his targets per game were relatively steady across 2020 and 2022 when he was fully available--so, yes, the TDs were definitely an outlier. He had a poorer season with regard to catch % prior to getting hurt in 2021, but we have a pretty good idea how the Packers with 12 have used him.

1 points
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Thegreatreynoldo's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:50 am

"But if anything, bringing Tonyan back just gives the Packers more options. If they wanted to go after more depth in the secondary or at wideout, that would also make sense."

Taking stress out of the draft is a valid reason to re-sign Tonyan, but it makes sense for WR, Reed on the DL, and for safety if they had a safety worth re-signing.

Tonyan no longer is a long-term guy for GB. Well, at least I'd say he is worth only one more long term deal after he signs a prove-it deal for 2023 with some team. I suppose re-signing him for a year while also hoping the drafts falls so that a TE GB likes comes free in the right round works as well as anything. TEs take a year or longer to develop.

So, it might be okay to re-sign Tonyan, but it ain't a thrilling prospect.

5 points
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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:52 am

Rudy Ford is a decent veteran safety/STer, and he could return, too. Not for much money

4 points
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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:51 am

I heard he's grown 4 inches and added 40 lbs to play TE, too! ;)

1 points
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Packerpasty's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:11 am

He's getting older, he sure isn't getting faster, he's rather mediocre as far as TE's go, bring him back as a bargain, sure wouldn't overpay for him...cant keep all the fan favorites if you want a contender....

4 points
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pantz_bURp's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:19 am

I agree Pp, but also can't keep all of 12's favorites if you want to be a contender.

3 points
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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:27 am

But we aren't a contender

3 points
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RCPackerFan's picture

February 28, 2023 at 11:58 am

Why?

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PackyCheese500's picture

February 28, 2023 at 01:50 pm

Because we finished 8-9 and missed the playoffs. Now you tell me why we are a contender.

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Coldworld's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:15 am

Tonyan is a perfectly adequate player. I think he’s likely better this year one year removed from his ACL. Having him on the team is not a bad thing per se.

However, I am puzzled about last season and his usage within the offense, which declined not increased, despite what I saw as an increased level of athleticism on his part. If LaFleur doesn’t feel able to use him as a regular snap getter and part of the game plan, something is amiss. There is no point in Bringing back a 29 year old player unless that changes.

Related to that is the, I think consensus, view that our TE room needs to get better. Can we if we keep Tonyan as its leader? If we do draft a move TE early, will we not want him out there offensively? If so, Tonyan would seem redundant. That is true even if LaFleur would use the role more. My best guess is that they want an all around TE, based on the above and their previously expressed hopes for Davis—which showed no signs of materializing.

To me those questions precede that of cost, which needs to be reasonable. This is especially so because if there is a year to retool and reshape at TE, this is seemingly the draft class to do so. Maybe if they take Washington as opposed to a move early we can retool with him and Tonyan and develop behind them. Otherwise I can’t see a path clearly enough to call for retaining Tonyan or not.

I suspect that they will let him test FA, partly due to our cap crunch. If he gets a good deal from another team he’s gone, if not I suspect we will try to wait until after the draft to make a decision. Part of that may depend on what happens to guy like Amos in FA. We may feel what cap we have is better spent on a veteran at another position and it may be that restricted that this plays a part in the Tonyan decision.

3 points
5
2
T7Steve's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:52 am

In 20 his biggest stat for me was that he barely had any drops, so Rodgers had no qualms about targeting him. At the start of 21 he was dropping, thus got targeted allot less.

Is it too much of a gamble to hope he gets quicker AND fixes his drops?

-1 points
1
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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 10:06 am

Just to add, Tonyan was asked to chip and help on DEs in support of Nijman in 2021 more than in 2020 when Bakh was playing, too, so that would impact timing, routes run, and catch totals, but I also agree that his catch % was low for him, too. I also read that he came into camp a little heavy in 2021 to support blocking in the Packers' offense, but I can't find that reference as I look, now.

1 points
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13TimeChamps's picture

February 28, 2023 at 10:12 am

He had a 79.1% catch rate last season.

1 points
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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:17 am

"If we do draft a move TE early, will we not want him out there offensively? If so, Tonyan would seem redundant. That is true even if LaFleur would use the role more."

The Packers pretty steadily have been in the 1.3-1.4 TE per snap range over the last couple years. Lewis has steadily been a 41% guy over his time in GB--regardless of other players' availability--which really means that there's one more "TE" on the field every snap--that's your move/F TE. Those have been pretty steady numbers, and seem unlikely to change unless they just can't find a Lewis-type blocker to fill that role. People might not agree with me when I say that player--the blocker--might be the more pressing find for the offense's overall health.

Someone else mentioned that Tonyan's ypc (under 9) was pathetic (and it is), but--as most FFLers can attest--it's also symptomatic of usage at the TE position over the last couple years: only the top couple TEs are putting up gaudy numbers. Most others are low-yardage types. Everyone wants a Travis Kelce or a Mark Andrews...they certainly change what you do on the field, but they're unicorns. It's as much about usage, scheme, and fit as it is about gaudy prospects who run fast.

https://www.lineups.com/nfl/tight-end-te-stats

3 points
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Coldworld's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:35 am

That’s my point about usage, although it could also be driven by a perceived lack of talent. There is no point investing picks or cap in what one won’t use. LaFleur wanted and got a H Back but we rarely use the position. Which is the chicken and which the egg: talent or offensive design?

3 points
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LeotisHarris's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:43 am

"He's a perfectly good TE with plenty of wear left in him, and he'll last a long time if you take good care of him." - Everyone's Dad

4 points
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lou's picture

February 28, 2023 at 08:44 am

Just love how he plays the game and you could make a case no one in the league has better hands, as they say "look it up". On the other hand no matter how big his heart is if the burst doesn't come back in the 2nd year after the ACL it makes little difference. Had the injury not occurred he would be in line for a nice extension at this point but the best approach for the Packers would be an incentive based contract which would be fair to everyone.

5 points
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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:20 am

"On the other hand no matter how big his heart is if the burst doesn't come back in the 2nd year after the ACL it makes little difference."

I would argue that getting TEs open looks in the short to mid range is as much about scheme and protecting the QB as it is about burst and speed.

1 points
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marpag1's picture

February 28, 2023 at 11:11 am

"I would argue that getting TEs open looks in the short to mid range is as much about scheme and protecting the QB as it is about burst and speed."

The importance of scheme is never an argument in favor of keeping inferior players.

5 points
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Johnblood27's picture

February 28, 2023 at 02:43 pm

If Tonyan has an enlarged heart I would definitely NOT sign him to a professional football contract!

1 points
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Packerpasty's picture

February 28, 2023 at 05:24 pm

"No one in the league has better hands"....now that funny...

-1 points
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The_Baloney_Stops_Here's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:31 am

Why? He's a replacement level player at best whos speed never came back post-ACL tear. I find it hard to believe they wont be able to find a suitable replacement.

2 points
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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 09:44 am

As a reference, here are the higher-end free-agent TEs (CHTV site doesn't like multiple links by a single poster on a single thread, so you'll have to add the "https://www." on your own)...

cbssports.com/nfl/news/2023-nfl-free-agency-te-market-dalton-schultz-mike-gesicki-among-best-available-players-at-position/

A Foster Moreau or Drew Sample might not excite people, but they are dual-purpose combo-TE guys who will come at or below the Robert Tonyan price tag, play with their hands on the ground, block and catch, and could take the heat off the need to acquire a dedicated in-line guy while still allowing a draft pick snaps to develop.

0 points
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The_Baloney_Stops_Here's picture

February 28, 2023 at 10:04 am

Id be perfectly fine pairing Moreau or Sample with a draft pick or two. Im really hoping they try to find their George Kittle/Owen Daniel i.e. undersized but athletic tight end who could thrive in the alleged Shanahan-style offense we were promised.

1 points
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dobber's picture

February 28, 2023 at 10:12 am

Honestly, likely a better investment than Tonyan for similar $.

0 points
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KnockTheSnotOutOfYou's picture

February 28, 2023 at 10:09 am

Have always believed Tonyan better than most have given him credit for. Great hands and a move TE, but just never given as much opportunity as he should have.

I'd like Tonyan back at the appropriate price with the Packers picking up another quality TE in the draft. Maybe two! A Tonyan resigning would allow the Packers should they want to keep round 1 draft capital for other positions, and then try selecting a TE like Darnell Washington in round 2. Haven't even gotten to the Combine yet and Darnell's draft value bouncing all over the board. However, his value seems to be continuously climbing. At the moment seems like he might be available at the Packers #45 spot, but then you see on other draft boards he could slip into the end of round 1.

1 points
1
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CheesyTex's picture

February 28, 2023 at 01:49 pm

Bring Big Bob Back.

#12 trusts him and his experience can help #10 if 12 is gone.

If 13 is gone, he is flexible enough to handle many of those snaps. (As someone pointed out earlier, maybe even consider him as a cheaper 1 for 1 swap if #13 leaves).

Most Rookie TE's do not produce in year one.

He has a cult following in GB.

He isn't too expensive for a starter at his position.

Bring Big Bob Back.

0 points
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asmith1969's picture

February 28, 2023 at 02:35 pm

Big Bad Bobby Tonyan only needs to be brought back on a 1 year minimum deal. His burst and separation is quite frankly, gone. The feel good story of his journey is all well and good, however they need weapons, not converted QB’s to TE. The Degura 3rd round pick was a complete disaster for a Swiss Army type player. No bueno. Time to get the area scouts to take a deep dive into TE’s that can be developed. Facts. Out. GPG! 👊👍✌️🏈

2 points
2
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Leatherhead's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:42 pm

We need at least 4 or 5 in the TE room.

Deguara is under contract. Tonyan wants to come back and he caught 53 balls. Add a guy early in the draft.....the Top 4 TEs may all be gone by #40. And there's the other guy I always forget who we picked up. There's our 4. And we could always look for a Day 3 guy to start the season on the practice squad.

I'd spread Tonyan's guaranteed money over 3 years. If he's still playing by then, great.

0 points
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stockholder's picture

February 28, 2023 at 07:55 pm

You can't draft a Te,
when you need another back-up QB.
Especially if you think like Gute.

0 points
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golfpacker1's picture

March 03, 2023 at 07:53 pm

I guess I would take a TE all day long that gives you 50 catches and 9 YPC as Tonyan did. That alot of 1st downs. Its mainly Rodgers fault and also the coaching staff that Tonyan only had 2 touchdowns. It was a real down year for Rodgers and not all the receivers fault either as he would tell you. When Rodgers war playing good he even made Richard Rodgers really good. We haven't hit on any TE we drafted in last 10 years. I thought Sternberger would be really good. Its hard to tell if Deguara is any good the way we use him. If Tonyan played for the Chiefs Mahommes would make him look like an all-pro. Rodgers was the main reason our offence sucked. He has got to go. He doesn't own the Packers, he is an employee.

1 points
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BirdDogUni's picture

March 03, 2023 at 08:44 pm

Austin Allen - 6' 8" 253 LBS... (Nebraska)

Deguara isn't much, but can help on STs.

Tonyan - Would love to have him back. Think he'll be even better another year removed from the ACL.

Nick Guggemos - 6' 5" 247 LBS - University of St. Thomas (He's on the roster at Packers.Com...

We still need to draft at least one TE, no matter how they feel about the guys above.

Would love to trade Rodgers to the Raiders for 7 and 38 at minimum. At 38 overall, we ought to be able to draft one of the top TEs...

0 points
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