Hello Wisconsin: Through Eight Weeks, the Green Bay Packers are Directionless
By TimBackes
It’s getting hard for me to determine what, exactly, the plan is with the Green Bay Packers.
Until this year, Brian Gutekunst has had relatively good success as the general manager of the Packers in his efforts to try to have his cake and eat it too when it came to team building. The team was winning a lot of games with a talented roster while also keeping an eye on the future. It hasn’t been quite good enough, as the team has failed to return to a Super Bowl despite having ample opportunity to do so.
Bill Huber on SI.com wrote a solid article this week on how that approach has largely failed the Packers over the last couple decades. His article, worth reading in its own right (even if I don’t entirely agree with 100% of it), does a great job of something I’ve been trying to articulate recently: the Packers are a team without direction.
Just look at the most recent decision by the Packers to stand pat at the trade deadline.
I completely understand the decision to not go out and try to bring in a player who almost certainly won’t make the difference in turning this ship around. The Packers are a bad football team. Bad football teams should not be buyers at the trade deadline.
But also, the Packers are… a bad football team. They’re in an unenviable position with the salary cap. The team has not come close to playing up to expectations, largely due to players on the team simply not being as good as they were supposed to be (with there also being some significant coaching issues).
To me, the worst outcome at the trade deadline would have been to have nothing happen. It sounds like the Packers were in on Chase Claypool, who ended up going to Chicago. Which, whatever–Claypool isn’t saving this Packers offense.
But to also come away without any assets in the form of draft picks or cap space is also disappointing.
It’s just the latest sign of a team without any clear direction. Gutekunst has spent his tenure without making a clear, firm commitment to building around Rodgers or building for the future. And it very nearly worked; he almost got a Super Bowl or two. But that didn’t happen, and now the team is starting to see the effects of him trying to have it both ways.
Do the Packers have any sort of understanding of what their championship window is/was? This offseason, Andy Herman had a fantastic video on his YouTube channel going over this exact question. A failure to understand your window can have catastrophic consequences, and it’s always better to make big changes a year too early than a year too late.
Right now, it’s hard to say what exactly Gutekunst judges this team’s capabilities to be. From this fan’s perspective, it’s impossible to envision a championship run from the 2022 Packers, and difficult (and getting more so by the day) to envision the team appearing in the playoffs. For the Packers to maintain the status quo in such a circumstance is… discomforting.
It feels like team leadership at many levels (front office, coaches, players) is either lacking or is not on the same page. What Rodgers says regularly contradicts what Matt LaFleur says, for example.
Who are the strongest voices inside 1265 Lombardi right now? Who are the ones people can listen to in times like what the Packers are experiencing at this moment?
The Packers are rudderless, drifting toward an uncertain destination. The loss to Buffalo on Sunday night inched the team closer to the point of no return for the 2022 season.
And don’t give me any of this “moral victory” hogwash. If fans want to take comfort in some “silver linings” of a game in which the Packers were never really competitive that is certainly their prerogative. But if the Packers start thinking in that mindset, they’ve already doomed themselves.
After half a season, this is who the Packers are: an underachieving football team without a clear direction and without the obvious leadership needed to work their way back into the picture.
Wisconsin Beer of the Week
Not enough breweries make a good schwarzbier, and so when I find one, I need to grab it up while it’s available. One recent one was Soul Memory, a 5% ABV brew from Hacienda Beer Company, based in Baileys Harbor, WI (with a satellite location here in MIlwaukee).
The brewery describes it as an “ultra black lager brewed with a balanced selection of roasty dark malts and hopped with GR Hallertau Mittelfruh and CZ Saaz hops.” So not only is it a German style beer, but they’re even using hops originating from germany.
Roasty is definitely the word; it had a bit more of a roasted flavor than many schwarzbiers while still maintaining that classic smoothness you expect out of the style.
Expect a hint of coffee and nuttiness due to the roasted malts used in the brewing of the beer.
Not sure if these are still available in liquor stores, but I’ve seen it checked in on Untappd recently, so you could likely find it at the brewery or at restaurants in Milwaukee.
Always reach for a schwarzbier!
The schedule does not favor Green Bay
I hate to take such a negative tone, but boy, even as someone who is typically a bright-eyed optimist it’s hard to see the Packers winning more than a couple more games this season.
After this weekend against Detroit, which is a winnable game (though I certainly wouldn’t count on it), the Packers get:
Dallas
Tennessee
At Philadelphia
At Chicago
Los Angeles Rams
At Miami
Minnesota
Detroit
Right now, the Packers are playing nowhere near well enough to manage Dallas or Philadelphia. Tennessee is a crapshoot. The Bears are currently a better football team than the Packers, but it is the Bears, so give them a win there. The Packers do not typically play well in Florida and Miami is a good team. Minnesota is far superior to the Packers at the moment, and though divisional games are a tossup it’s hard to see the Packers competing there. Los Angeles is up and down; hard to know what to expect from them. Detroit at home should be a win, or so one would think.
I see two or three games left in which I have a reasonable level of confidence in the Packers. That’s it. Out of the final eight games of the season.
There are those saying the Packers made positive steps forward against Buffalo, and I guess I see some of that. But they’ll have to show me much more than a little bit of driving against a team that was playing essentially an entire half of garbage time. I haven’t seen anything yet to make me think this team can win more than three or four more games the entire season.
Of course, as they say, that’s why they play the games. But halfway through the season, the time has passed for the Packers to “figure it out.” At a certain point you have to accept a team for being what it is, and the Packers are rapidly approaching that point.
The Rodgers Watch, Part V
Aaron Rodgers did look a little bit more like his old self this weekend, but there’s a long way to go before he’s playing football to anywhere near his standards.
There was one point in the game where he let rip a deep pass to a well-covered Romeo Doubs. It was incomplete, but it was the best ball thrown deep Rodgers has had since the first week of the season; it had zip and precision and resembled balls Rodgers would throw at the height of his powers.
But the ball still generally isn’t being thrown over the middle of the field or more than a couple yards past the line of scrimmage. We saw a little bit more of that this week, but Rodgers himself said during the week that the team has to be better at pushing the ball down the field in the passing game if they’re going to turn things around on offense, and he’s exactly right.
To this point, Rodgers hasn’t shown anything justifying the massive contract he received this offseason. While there are many other things that need to happen for the Packers to turn this season around, they simply cannot do it unless Rodgers starts playing closer to his caliber.
Around the NFC North
Once again we’ll take a quick look around the NFC North at what the Packers’ rivals are doing.
- The CHICAGO BEARS have been improving noticeably on the offensive side of the football since the start of the year. They scored 29 points against a tough Dallas defense, and Justin Fields had one of his better days as a pro to date (still making a couple pretty boneheaded errors). In adding Chase Claypool, the Bears now have another young receiver with a lot of potential who could be a building block on that team for years to come. While the Bears certainly are not a threat to anyone this season, these are the kinds of moves that a team needs to make in their position. Claypool is young, still cheap, and ascending.
- The DETROIT LIONS fought hard against a good Dolphins team but came up just short in the end. They then turned into sellers at the trade deadline, dealing tight end TJ Hockenson within the division (?!) to the Minnesota Vikings. That was a surprise for me, I must say; Hockenson is young and talented and felt like a piece the Lions would want to maintain, but sometimes you have to take the opportunity to get more assets and more potential to build when you have as many deficiencies as this team does.
- The MINNESOTA VIKINGS are the division’s best team, a surprising 6-1, and just added a heck of an offensive weapon in Hockenson. Right now it’s looking like a cakewalk for them to a divisional title. The only thing holding them back is, well, the fact that they’re the Vikings. How many times have we seen this franchise crap away a strong start to the season? But with a completely new regime in place, maybe this decades-long history of disappointment is starting to turn ar—nahhhh.
Get your turkeys ordered!
Folks!
Thanksgiving is a mere three weeks away. Can you believe it?
I have been informed there is a national turkey shortage at the moment. So if you are not in the habit of pre-ordering your bird, make sure you do that ASAP! I called my order in to the local butcher a week ago for pickup on Wednesday the 23rd; 20-lb. bird coming to me already thawed.
There’ll be much more about the goodness of Thanksgiving food in this space later to come this month, but consider this your official Hello Wisconsin reminder to place your turkey orders and not trust that there’ll be Butterballs available in your frozen foods aisle!
Final look: Packers at Lions and Week 9 Picks
Look, my expectations for the Packers are absolutely rock bottom at this point. People can talk about “moral victories” all they want with the Bills, but the Bills had absolutely zero motivation to care about the game in the second half. If they wanted to, they could have blown that game wide open, even more so than it was going into half time.
The Lions, to me, are a team that has much more fight in them, even if they have a worse team overall. They’re going to give the Packers everything they can handle. And to be fair, the Packers can’t exactly handle a whole heck of a lot.
The Packers should be able to win, but they also should have been able to beat Washington and both the New York teams. Until they prove otherwise, I don’t see this team winning more than a couple more games this season.
Lions 23, Packers 20
EAGLES over Texans
PATRIOTS over Colts
LIONS over Packers
CHARGERS over Falcons
BILLS over Jets
VIKINGS over Commanders
BENGALS over Panthers
RAIDERS over Jaguars
DOLPHINS over Bears
SEAHAWKS over Cardinals
RAMS over Bucs
CHIEFS over Titans
RAVENS over Saints
LAST WEEK: 10-5
SEASON TOTAL: 68-55
PLEASE SUBSCRIBE TO OUR CHEESEHEAD NATION WEEKLY NEWSLETTER HERE.
__________________________
Tim Backes is a lifelong Packer fan and a contributor to CheeseheadTV. Follow him on Twitter @timbackes for his Packer takes, random musings and Untappd beer check-ins.
__________________________
Comments (62)
T7Steve
November 03, 2022 at 06:40 am
"After half a season, this is who the Packers are: an underachieving football team without a clear direction and without the obvious leadership needed to work their way back into the picture."
Just win ONE! That's the only way to look at it. One game at a time.
"Figure it out."
It seems every team they play has figured it out. That's why the Packers can't figure it out. Let's try the same thing a little differently and see if it will work. Complicated simplicity.
The only hope at this point is that they're actually geniuses and are trying to sneak into the playoffs and then start playing. Playing their best football during the season hasn't worked up to this point so, what do they have to lose?
mnbadger
November 03, 2022 at 12:14 pm
I totally agree with Tim and T7Steve.
Thus, I want to re-enforce the same paragraph from the article:
"After half a season, this is who the Packers are: an underachieving football team without a clear direction and without the obvious leadership needed to work their way back into the picture."
I'm sorry, but we need a significant house cleaning at all of the highest positions. In no particular order, qb1, HC, OC, DC, GM and maybe president?
MarkMrfy is retiring at the end of the season. IMO, he should clean out the mess before his successor steps in. Fresh slate to work with in 2023.
GPG!
NickPerry
November 03, 2022 at 06:45 am
Nice piece Tim...Thanks for a great read...
"The team has not come close to playing up to expectations, largely due to players on the team simply not being as good as they were supposed to be (with there also being some significant coaching issues)."
Excellent statement and I'm glad you mentioned the coaching issues. IMO not enough has been said about the combined losses of Hackett, Getsy, and Otten. Then with the promotions of other coaches who have NO BUSINESS in their new positions, this is a terrible, inexperienced offensive coaching staff, AND it shows more and more each week.
Maybe Hackett isn't a good HC but as an OC he was pretty good, especially when matched with MLF. Getsy had been around for a while and was someone Rodgers had trusted. Steno has NO BUSINESS being an offensive coordinator, just like Luke Butkus has NO BUSINESS being the O-Line Coach. Now it's not that I don't think they could be one day, but CLEARLY, they weren't ready for these positions. Neither here or IN Denver.
"But to also come away without any assets in the form of draft picks or cap space is also disappointing."
I understand selling off assets is a sign of giving up, but IF there ever was a time to do so, it would have been Tuesday, November 1st before 4:00 PM EST. As much as I love Aaron Jones could have the Packers gotten anything in return for him? ESPECIALLY after the way, he's run the ball ALL season. I'll admit, I haven't looked at his contract lately so maybe the way the Packers have F'ed themselves pushing so much money to the future, Jones's contract isn't tradeable.
Or how about Darnell Savage or Amos? Both will probably be gone next season, could we have gotten ANYTHING for either of them? I mean who cares if there's not another Safety on the roster (UGH Gute)? Besides, Barry still hasn't figured out the BEST way to use Savage is as a robber, just like Pettine did the 2nd half of 2020. Just unbelievable that the switch hasn't been made after 26 games including playoffs. Barry is an ILB Coach...That's ALL he is!
The "Homer" in me still thinks this Packers team can win this weekend in Detroit. The Lions have a HORRIBLE defense, especially against the run. But how many times have we seen the Packers play a BAD defense only to be completely shut down? Washington 2 weeks ago comes to mind.
Coldworld
November 03, 2022 at 11:05 am
The real time to sell assets was earlier this year, but otherwise I agree to a point. I’m not sure we’d have had huge takers for anything that Murphy could pass off as not admitting he forced us into the rocks. We won’t even let go of coaches.
stockholder
November 03, 2022 at 07:19 am
The unthinkable has happened. And Rodger’s thumb still hurts. You only have to look at the OL. Rodger’s has been coping with the worst OL since he became a starter.
And it started as an “ experiment”, from day one. Somebody should have paid the price for it. Not RODGERS!!
In and Out never works. Durability issues must end!!
Denial has been the biggest reason to this teams failure. The DL never became championship Quality. And this secondary never became the catalyst of the defense.
The players are now less enthusiastic, or energetic. The changes have changed the direction of this team. And Fan support.
Buy ,Sell, Trade? Not one guy was going to change anything.
Razer
November 03, 2022 at 07:31 am
...Not one guy was going to change anything...
It was one of the reasons that I didn't expect much by the trade deadline. The front office has painted itself into a corner with the heavy contracts. Not sure how Gutekunst and company plan on building a solid roster going forward.
Coldworld
November 03, 2022 at 11:39 am
Gute’s plan looks fairly clear (and has for a couple of years at least), a good D (coaching over quality I think) and a strong running game with a young QB developing with young receivers and some cap free to add a little talent or QB competition to plug holes while the dead cap worked out.
Cwilly
November 03, 2022 at 11:00 pm
Do you ever think our gm is bad and it’s not clear why sign Rodgers for 50 million but not play the young qb you talk about. The team hasn’t drafted well and are paying for it. Rodgers isn’t Rodgers now but it’s like watching favre again. How long can you ride the coattails before all see what you are. You just don’t get it this is a franchise issue that has no consequences for what they do. Love was a bad pick and many others. Now Rodgers is old and we see what this team is. It’s not even competitive now and that’s sad. So stop hating Rodgers when your gm is awful.
NickPerry
November 04, 2022 at 05:10 am
Have you ever thought Mark Murphy started to break down what had made this franchise so successful in the first place... He became involved with players and coaches on this roster.
When Bob Harlon was hired and brought in Ron Wolf the first thing that was done is Wolf was made to be in charge of EVERYTHING TEAM related. Harlon had NOTHING to do with players and coaches.
All that changed when McCarthy was still here and Murphy changed this to EVERYONE reported to him. McCarthy, Gute, and Russ Ball all reported to Murphy. Hey, Gute isn't blameless but if you think signing Rodgers was ALL on Gute, I'm sorry but you're just wrong. That was ALL Mark Murphy. Gute has been caught in the middle of an impossible task. Trying to win now AND build for the future.
Gute deserves some of the blame no doubt, but Murphy is the one who KILLED the Packers. Until he's gone and a new Team President (God, not Russ Ball please) comes in and hires a GM with COMPLETE control over the TEAM, things around 1265 Lombardi are going to be much closer to this season than the previos 28 or so BEFORE Mark Murphy became more involved.
jannesbjornson
November 03, 2022 at 09:10 am
The heave-ho with Barry should have been during his job interview. Soft serve is his game. If you sit in two deep, your CBs have to be able to play press cover and the safeties have to move to the ball fast. Not happening. Apparently Gutedkunst is happy with the O line charade, not a sniff for a RT up to the deadline?
Coldworld
November 03, 2022 at 11:07 am
Good tackles don’t get traded.
jannesbjornson
November 03, 2022 at 12:14 pm
Duane Brown to the Seahawks, for one, but they indeed are rare.
Razer
November 03, 2022 at 07:21 am
Dark beer, dark article. Almost went back to bed. I saw enough in the Buffalo game to know that there is a decent team somewhere in our lockerroom. The roster holes and weak coaching have set the ceiling for the 2022 Packers and may very well lead to a total rebuild after the season. I can live with a 500 club that is missing too many pieces. I can't stand the bumbling, lifeless effort shown for much of the season. Finish strong and be proud to wear the 'G'.
dobber
November 03, 2022 at 07:40 am
Uh, Tim, you predicted last week's games.
But hey, you still got 10 of 15 right, so you got that goin' for ya.
Johnblood27
November 03, 2022 at 07:49 am
One peanut butter cookie for you kind Sir.
Johnblood27
November 03, 2022 at 07:44 am
Time to call Servepro to come and clean house - completely.
"Like it never happened'
HarryHodag
November 03, 2022 at 08:47 am
Replaced by...?
Johnblood27
November 03, 2022 at 07:49 am
Time to call Servepro to come and clean house - completely.
"Like it never happened'
Handsback
November 03, 2022 at 08:04 am
Well said Tim. One of the condondrums of the Packers in IMHO deals with changing either the front office or the coaching staff. The blame lies in how they organized the two groups. Essentially Murphy is the GM with Gutsey as head personnel manager and MLF as the HC reporting to him. Think of Murphy being the low key version of the Cowboys Jerry Jones..
With that leadership structure and the poor performance in many areas of the team, I expect MLF to get the boot. More than anything else his failure to improve his staff will be his downfall. As HC he is responsible for all phases of the players performance. If the team Gutsey gave him isn't getting it done it seems like he will be the fall guy.
All that said...the team's structure will still be an issue.
jannesbjornson
November 03, 2022 at 09:14 am
Toss in Low-Ball for the fiduciary malpractice.
Guam
November 03, 2022 at 08:06 am
I agree the Packers are directionless right now, but I don't agree that Gute was the architect of this mess. I think Murphy reversed course on Rodgers last winter and resigned him rather than trading him. Either way, this would have been a bad year for the Packers and their fans, but at least there would have been a future in sight had they traded Rodgers. With Rodgers in decline and carrying his massive contract along with other contracts designed for "a last dance", the Packers have nowhere to go but down for awhile.
I lived through the Lombardi era, the 70's and 80's, the Favre/Rodgers era and I will survive what is to come over the next few years. The Packers will rise again. GPG.
KnockTheSnotOutOfYou
November 03, 2022 at 08:47 am
Agree Guam, but it did not need to happen. That one decision to resign changed the direction of this team and its fortunes for quite some time to come. What management & coaching decide to do the rest of the season will also impact this team moving forward. Hopefully they do not further compound their mistake.
dobber
November 03, 2022 at 12:29 pm
The problem when the Board meddles in personnel and the day to day operations of the team--your plan is never yours. It's directionless because you can't have one person making 95% of the personnel decisions, and another making the most impactful 5% of the calls. Gutey is getting to buy the groceries and make the house payments, but I'm pretty sure that MM used Gutey's budget to buy a month-long trip to the Maldives.
It seemed those first couple years when the structure was put in place, that it might work out. Winning games covers a lot of problems. But even way back at draft time in 2020, there seemed to be a shift in place that really required the team stay the course....but then Covid hit, which forced radical shifting in cap management, and any kind of planning that was in place in 2019 is now gone.
Will it cost LaF his job? I don't think so. It's hard to justify firing a guy who has won 39 games in three years unless he's clearly lost this roster and they play listless football the rest of the way. He'll be back in 2023. While it's on him to make the best of what he's given, he doesn't make the key calls on roster construction and he's handcuffed to a QB who has won every internal battle he's fought while in town--it's a monster of management's making. What that looks like in the long run, I don't know--but it could be that there will be demands that he radically change his staff (usually a key indicator of a HC on the hot seat), and if he declines to do so, it could further justify sending him packing.
RCPackerFan
November 03, 2022 at 08:40 am
"It’s getting hard for me to determine what, exactly, the plan is with the Green Bay Packers."
I can tell you what the plan wasn't. The plan wasn't for the OL and WR position to be battling injuries the whole year.
They felt good about Bakhtiari and Jenkins coming back. They knew they would be back sooner then later. They didn't account for them to miss games after they came back. They didn't account for Newman regressing in his 2nd year. Which maybe part of that was due to them having him work at RT. They didn't take into account that Jenkins was going to struggle playing RT. They didn't take into account that they were going to have to move OL around 7 games into the season.
For WR they had a good plan. They had Lazard and Cobb returning. They brought in Watkins as a veteran to help keep things smooth until Watson and Doubs were ready. They didn't account for the amount of injuries they have suffered at the position. Lazard, Watkins, Cobb have all missed time. Cobb and Watkins both have been on IR. Lazard has missed a couple of games. Watson has missed a lot of time.
I do believe that at this point if they haven't had as many injuries on the OL and the WR positions our offense would be looking much better by now. Maybe now that the OL is getting settled in, they will improve. Maybe now that they have been getting Doubs, Toure, Rodgers more playing time, they will be better. Watkins is entering his 3rd week after coming off of IR. Hopefully he can contribute. Lazard will be back this week.
The Rodgers Watch, Part V
I really don't know how much Rodgers thumb has affected his throwing. His passes looked better in this game.
To me it looks like Rodgers and the younger WR's are finally getting in tune. Doubs made a couple of great catches. They are building something together. Toure made a tremendous adjustment. Rodgers is gaining trust in #8 Rodgers. I would have loved to have seen what they were going to do with Watson. They talked about having a big package for him. His speed is a difference maker for the offense.
Final look: Packers at Lions and Week 9 Picks
I disagree with you on the Packers/Bills second half. Packers played with much better energy and much better physicality. They didn't allow the Bills to control the LOS and they played with much more heart. The offense found the run game. For the people saying the Bills weren't interested. They really weren't trying to tackle our RB's? Really? Lets give the Packers some credit. They played much better because of them, not because of the Bills.
I haven't' given any predictions this year. I don't like predicting games. That being said, this is a make it right game for the Packers. This is a game that they can get somethings going their way. This is a game they can build confidence in. Rodgers was right when he said sometimes it just takes 1 to turn things around. Many won't give the Packers a chance in this game. Which why should they. But i think they finally found something to hang their hat on. They can run the ball. They can use play action. And Rodgers has more trust in Doubs to throw down field to him in tight coverage.
The Lions aren't an easy team to play. And they will definitely be searching for blood from GB. BUt this is the turn around game GB needs. I do believe they figured somethings out in the BIlls game. This game they figure things out offensively and have their best performance. They also figure things out defensively.
Packers 34 - Lions 13.
PeteK
November 03, 2022 at 09:40 am
Fully agree RC, there are many unforeseen problems with this team. I also believe that mentally when a SB contending team loses some games there is a mental let down. This reminds me of the 90 season under Infante when the Pack went 6-10 after a 10-6 season that saw Infante win coach of the year honors. 30-24 Pack win
RCPackerFan
November 03, 2022 at 04:02 pm
There just have been to many injuries on offense to get into a rhythm.
calabasa
November 03, 2022 at 12:18 pm
RC- agreed on the OL problems.
As for WR, I think they overplayed their hand. We've seen over the years how hard it is for rookies to make significant impacts, and while Doubs is emerging, Watson and his hammie is a more predictable trajectory.
Lazard? Not a #1. And if anyone is surprised that Cobb- love him- is injured, they haven't watched his career.
RCPackerFan
November 03, 2022 at 04:26 pm
I think their plan was solid overall. BUT they didn't factor into account that Watkins and Cobb have had a history of injuries. They were betting on that wouldn't happen, and they were wrong. They didn't think Watson would miss as much time as he has though either.
I don't think they were looking at it as Lazard number 1, Cobb 2, Watkins 3... I think they look at it as they are all apart of the rotation. That Rodgers would be able to find them in progression.
Unfortunately they haven't been healthy, and the combination of that and the OL mess, it has created a mess offensively.
And we have no idea how much the thumb injury is impacting Rodgers.
I do feel like we are going to turn the corner though. I know its mostly doom and gloom and has been. I just feel like they are figuring things out on the OL and the WR's are starting to figure things out.
croatpackfan
November 03, 2022 at 04:12 pm
RCP Fan, you never make business decisions on hope everything will be OK. You need to have more than several plans for "ifs". Also, you are not building championship team on former WR3 (AL), old WR without significant impact on former team - Texans (RC) and on cheap leftover from SB contender (SW - God, they replaced him with MVS).
That is how I see it. Brian Gutekunst made only one mistake, as far as I see, but it may not be mistake after all. One important thing is that we do not know what Packers knows about Jordan Love. Maybe he needed that 3rd full year to grow to the level he can play competent games. Maybe they were prepared to go with Jordan in rebuilding phase and they did not expect Aaron Rodgers will be back (especially when they found that Davante is very firm about decision that he will not stay with Packers). Or maybe that huge contract paired with several other contracts was reason why they decided that it is over with SB run with Aaron Rodgers. Last push they made was with this last push with Davante, when they offered him larger contract than Raiders. I understand why DA made decision to leave. He is clever guy. He did not want to be targeted that much any more - he had top targets last season or near he top. That much targets producing more hits and more opportunities for injuries. He clearly understood that he will not win SB ring as player. And his choice was to play with friend on team who is not SB contender, so less pressure and enough money for his future retirement.
What to do? Crippled by cap space Packers had to turn on draft. And I have no doubts that some WR choices (not all) was made in consult with Aaron Rodgers. By ACR comments on Watson, it was clear that he already envision so many deep passes to him he likes so much.
So, if Packers management made their plans just on hope that Bakh and Jenkins will return in the beginning of the season and that Royce Jesus Newman will play even better, and not addressing RT issue I can say only one thing - Packers upper management should be sued for malpractice and ruining goodwill of the franchise.
Win - lose record they achieved with MLF says more about team he inherit than about his work. They had team composed and well-coordinated. Easy schedule in 2019 gave that team excellent record with not much influence (it had some) from MLF as HC. I would say that record is more reflection on OC (Hackett) work than on MLF offensive ingenuity. And ACR was not showing any (if few) signs that Father time starting to influence on his game.
For me, Tim is right. This team is in turmoil. There is not much compactness there. Players don't feel comfortable in lockers room, less on the field. There is true lack of communication between them. For any team success, communication inside the team is of the utmost importance. And that is on coaches, not on management. I suspect the main reason of players discontent is that they are not asked to play to their strengths, but to schematic idea of the coaches. On D as well as on O. The only part of the team that at least looks like they play with competence and joy are ST.
So, you have GM, who is not real GM, because CEO of the company messing in his job and restrict him in doing it, putting him in situations he might never produced. So he can not go and say to HC something like: "If you do not get this team under your control, you are out of your job!" or "You brought that DC, you solve the mess, or both will be out-of-work!"
Now, he gets heat from fan base for decisions which he did not made (it is the only logical conclusion), but as good member of company and for PR reasons publicly support decisions, better to say, mistakes.
When child is not brought up, it is the result of bad upbringing or different approach of his/her parents. That kind of child makes many bad decision and try to rule over others. And nobody likes that.
For me, that is the main reason why Packers are now at the position they are.
HarryHodag
November 03, 2022 at 08:54 am
To me, the most damning thing is how the Packers faithful and national media bullied the Packers front office into keeping Rodgers. I think Gute saw the problem but there was pressure to keep Rodgers and build around him. Now there's a bunch of long term contracts and little flexibility to make the needed changes.
I know the popular thing was to resign Rodgers to an extension. But that decision will mean a long term mediocre team in Green Bay. Few people like Jordan Love, but if they had not signed all those huge contracts you could see getting behind a rebuilding team. But now you have a team that sucks and has little hope for the future.
I think the fans have to take a little responsibility for this fiasco. Unlike Ted Thompson who had the guts to unload an aging QB, Gute felt compelled to keep Rodgers around.
Roadrunner23
November 03, 2022 at 09:16 am
Bullshit Harry
A real general manager does what is best for the team!
Thompson, with all his flaws as a GM believed in his draft choice, Aaron Rodgers, and got rid of Brett Favre, which was probably even more unpopular. Then, if Gutekunst would’ve gotten rid of Aaron Rodgers this off-season.  The problem is our GM knew that he blew the Jordan love pic and had no choice but to keep an aging and unmotivated Aaron Rodgers. But you are right about one thing. This team is going to suck for a long time because of poor decision making.
Coldworld
November 03, 2022 at 11:15 am
That’s just wrong.
Firstly it seems very unlikely that Gute pushed for Rodgers. That appears to have been a Murphy charge despite cap and roster and Adams jumping ship.
Secondly, Thompson so believed in Aaron Rodgers that he drafted Brian Brohm with the none too secretive willingness to replace him in 2008. He also drafted Rodgers while Favre was still the man.
dobber
November 03, 2022 at 12:35 pm
I would argue that Aaron Rodgers made it possible for TT to make the decision he felt was best for the team, but it couldn't happen until #4 opened the door by retiring.
Coldworld
November 03, 2022 at 01:01 pm
Tractor watch was an institution before 2005.
PackEyedOptimist
November 03, 2022 at 08:59 am
You said almost everything I was going to say, RC!
The biggest reason we are where we are is the debilitating injuries to the OL and WR corps.
joeblowinski
November 03, 2022 at 09:00 am
To me, it looks like the Packers will suck until no longer affected by ARs contract. We're going back to the 70s for a while.
Roadrunner23
November 03, 2022 at 09:09 am
Good read as usual Tim and I always appreciate the Beer reviews you include (when the packers are bad at least we have beer 🍺)
I believe the worst thing that can happen to the Packers unfortunately is that they muddle through the season and win just enough games to not make the playoffs but make them think there are no problems.
Then the GM & coaches can use the old excuses (injuries, bad luck, the ball bounced the wrong way 🏈 rookies making mistakes, guys coming back from ACL injuries)
These are the excuses that were used in the 70’s & 80’s even when the packers had some good players and actually won more than they lost they always fell short.
There are BIG problems in Green Bay!
*Murphy, while an excellent businessman, should NOT be meddling in football matters.
*Gutekunst, seems like a nice guy but has wasted SO MANY draft picks! Think about this, he’s traded up for BURKS, LOVE, WATSON, AMARI RODGERS, SAVAGE. Gave away draft capital for these guys plus blown the pick on top of that!! He’s had a few hits but far too many misses!
He has also refused to get RODGERS any weapons after giving him the bag 💰.
In his tenure as GM this team has has historically bad special team yet when he finally starts to bring in guys and coaches to fix it, he refuses to get a legit return man!
*MLF while he has won a bunch of regular season games in a WEAK division, has now been exposed for what he is, a WEAK leader who bows to the throne of ARROGANT ARRON! He has also hired BAD COACHES, Mennenga, Barry, Drayton and promoted there best OL coach in years to OC and he is over his head!
*Rodgers got the bag 💰and didn’t show in the offseason and recently said that HALFWAY THROUGH THE SEASON he’s finally feeling motivated to play?! It’s like Michael Irvin stated recently “when a player starts talking retirement, he’s already retired in his mind”
THAT sho have been Gutekunst first clue to trade him to DENVER in the offseason!!!!!!!
The BEST thing for the Packers right now (and it hurts me to say this) is for the team to lose out, blow it up, trade Rodgers and his over inflated contract, dump guys like Bakhtiari, Cobb, Watkins, Lewis, Crosby and REBUILD! The other teams in the NFC North are getting better fast and this team is regressing fast with aging players and over inflated contracts!
Looking at the schedule the Packers most likely will finish
7 & 10 and in 3rd place in the NFC North. The Vikings are the class of the division, the Bears & Lions are getting better. The only way the Packers are going to see their flaws is for them to fall HARD! Then they will have no choice but to bite the bullet and get this team turned around!
Ask yourselves this honestly, when was the last time the Packers were basically out of the NFC North race halfway through the season?! Disgraceful!!
A RED WAVE is coming in Green Bay in the form of and off-season BLOOD 🩸 LETTING after a disappointing and dismal season!
Packerpasty
November 03, 2022 at 11:21 am
no team is going to trade for Rodgers..come on..common sense..
dobber
November 03, 2022 at 12:37 pm
Agreed. Unless 12 goes on an absolute tear the rest of the way, his market is gone--especially after what teams are seeing in Denver and Indy this year, I suspect they now see the 'buyer beware' side of aging QBs that wasn't clear with Stafford and Brady.
dobber
November 03, 2022 at 12:44 pm
"in the 70’s & 80’s even when the packers had some good players and actually won more than they lost "
You seem to be remembering a very different 70s and 80s than I do...they only had 4 winning seasons in those two decades. They lost far more than they won.
"win just enough games to not make the playoffs but make them think there are no problems."
Unless they blow every team out from here on, all the rookies play like all-pros, and the defense is pitching shutouts on a regular basis, I don't think there's enough lipstick to put on this pig to hide its problems.
Swisch
November 03, 2022 at 09:28 am
It may be that Gute is being hindered by Murphy insisting on signing over the team to Aaron Rodgers, and that LaFleur is being hindered by Rodgers interfering in coaching.
If that's the case, the Packers have an organizational dysfunction that practically ensures failure.
It seems Rodgers in his arrogance is the fault line around which the Packers crack and crumble under pressure. The bigger question concerns who is enabling him.
Coldworld
November 03, 2022 at 11:23 am
We’ve had an organizational dysfunction since TT became incapacitated. It was institutionalized by Murphy’s new structure. The result, a total failure as Head Coach and a roster with no offensive passing weapons who aren’t rookies, fragile or Lazard and a superstar QB with cap maxed out for the future. That can only come of dysfunction.
Swisch
November 03, 2022 at 12:00 pm
Gute as GM and LaFleur as head coach have had three straight seasons of 13 wins on their resumes -- which means that this past offseason they could have spoken out against the keeping of arrogant Rodgers with confidence that if the Packers fired them, they'd get the same jobs with other NFL teams.
It seems both have been put in difficult positions between Murphy and Rodgers, but at some point they could have spoken out against the indignity of their power being usurped by Rodgers backed by Murphy.
If they would only speak out now, it would seem to be of great help not only to them, but to us as fans in exposing dysfunction at the top of the franchise.
Sometimes in jobs we have to put up with things we don't like from others in the organization, but it can get to the point in which it's time to be bold in calling out serious mismanagement.
Packerpasty
November 03, 2022 at 11:24 am
if MLF is hindered by Rodgers in that way, I don't want the guy as my coach...he isn't the type to fire up a team and he isn't a very good coach, and Barry..send him packing..I predict MLF won't be here two years from now..maybe sooner...the coaching staff he assembled sucks..
marpag1
November 03, 2022 at 09:59 am
So the author was OK with the "direction" until this year, but this year through eight weeks it isn't clear if Gutey is committed to building around Rodgers or building for the future?
WTF?? Sorry, but that's probably the most absurd thing ever said on this board. Gutey just gave a 38-year old NFL player who has publicly discussed retirement a record-setting 50 million per year, knowing full well that he was pushing off the day of reckoning for his already stressed cap situation, and knowing that there could only be a few years at the very most before cap-hell surely had to come... and we're not sure if Gutey made a clear decision to roll with Aaron Rodgers in the short term window?
Really??
You can disagree with Gutey's "direction" if you want to, but how anyone can fail to see what his direction was is beyond me.
LambeauPlain
November 03, 2022 at 11:34 am
You are making the (wrong) assumption Gutey "gave" Rodgers $50 million. He does not have that authority. That was all on Murphy. He stated over and over Rodgers wasn't going anywhere. I believe Gutey wanted to trade him to Hackett for all that Denver treasure.
Gutey is not Ron Wolf or Ted Thompson. Not even in the same zip code. Gutey is simply a highly paid personnel manager who's every decision can (and many likely have been) overruled by Murphy, even Ball and ML.
The fish rots from the head and old freckle faced Howdy Doody Murphy has installed a dysfunctional management by committee system with him playing the General Manager. It stinks!
It was supposed to be a one year fix after 2017 as Ted was quickly fading away and MM was at war with Ball and Gutey over personnel. Howdy Doody got drunk on the GM gig and made it permanent. He is a shitty GM.
Where is the Exec Board?
Coldworld
November 03, 2022 at 11:49 am
The exec board is made up of people nominated by Murphy. That’s how they get there.
marpag1
November 03, 2022 at 12:39 pm
You can hypothesize all you want about WHO is setting the direction. I wasn't talking about that. I don't think the author was either.
The author said there is no clear direction. That's just bonkers. The ''direction" that management has taken could not possibly be more obvious and clear if it were tattooed onto everyone's forehead. It is utterly undeniable that management made a very conscious decision to mortgage the long-term prospects of the team in an attempt to win with Rodgers in the next year or two. How that is even open for debate, I don't know.
Coldworld
November 03, 2022 at 01:03 pm
It’s up for debate as to who and how Rodgers plus this cap and roster could seriously be seen by professionals as a rational concept.
marpag1
November 03, 2022 at 01:10 pm
So as I have said, everyone is free to criticize the direction that management has taken, if that's what they want to do. But it is certainly not difficult to see what direction management has taken.
Rarescope
November 03, 2022 at 10:05 am
"And don’t give me any of this “moral victory” hogwash. If fans want to take comfort in some “silver linings” of a game in which the Packers were never really competitive that is certainly their prerogative."
Tim falls to the level of the "phrase du jour" - do you guys always get together at the beginning of the week and pick something that every sports media writer absolutely must mention in any articles written that week? I'm really curious now where this "moral victory" term came from because it doesn't even seem like the right word. There's nothing ethical about playing a football game unless you're saying it would be unethical for the Packers to not play well just like it would be unethical for me to be writing this comment while I'm supposed to be working (which I am). Morale victory makes sense though - as in "the way they played was good for the team's morale" but it doesn't seem like anyone is saying that.
But yes, I absolutely will take it as a whatever victory simply because it's more entertaining to watch my team play reasonably well then terribly bad. People at 1265 Lambeau are paid actual money to figure out how to win games. My job is just to enjoy watching them ;)
T7Steve
November 03, 2022 at 10:21 am
"it would be unethical for me to be writing this comment while I'm supposed to be working (which I am)" OH-OH! And I thought I was better than everyone else. Only here WHEN I'm at work.
You made me laugh Rarescope. Why it's nice to come here even if we're losing. Thanks.
Rarescope
November 03, 2022 at 11:24 pm
My pleasure Ti85Steve - stoked to hear that someone around here appreciated my sense of humor ;)
Coldworld
November 03, 2022 at 11:00 am
We aren’t directionless. We are paying the price of trying to sail against the wind. We made a nonsensical choice. We had a direction it was just straight over the reef. Now we are there, there’s little to be done but sit tight, try to stem the leaks and avoid more damage till the tide lifts us off once the race is over.
Dragon5
November 03, 2022 at 11:18 am
Admission is the first step to recovery, right Tim? Well done.
BTW, you had a survey prior to beginning of season...are you going to revisit the submissions once the regular season concludes?
Booner
November 03, 2022 at 11:25 am
Remember Gute traded draft capital away to move up to get Jordan freaking Love! WTF is going on out there!!!!!!!
PatrickGB
November 03, 2022 at 12:11 pm
The plan for the Packers is to stay the course and improve with who you have. If there was a reasonable option for trade then we would have done so. There wasn’t. I am going out on a limb here and predict an improvement from within.
leche
November 03, 2022 at 12:19 pm
Said this back at the time, but the Jordan Love pick should have gotten Gute fired immediately, and set all of this current state in motion.
At the time, we had just gone 13-3 and made the NFC Championship Game, we were a good team with some holes to fill, had an outstanding but aging QB with 4 years left on his contract.
The clear and obvious roadmap was to basically go all in over those next 4 years, and allowing Rodgers to walk away or retire after 2023 with hopefully a couple of more Super Bowl rings in the process. The draft fell nicely for us toward players in positions of need. Notably Tee Higgins, Michael Pittman and Patrick Queen (who I will admit was my preference and that might not have worked out so well).
The decision to worry about the future and Rodgers replacement at that time didn't make any sense, particularly because Rodgers contract at the time still encompassed the entirety of Love's rookie deal. The only way this ever made sense is if we planned to move Rodgers on before his current deal expired anyway. But trading away your extremely talented QB when you have a really good, Super Bowl contending team is also a non-starter.
Flash forward to now and we're combining making a terrible decision with Jordan Love just being bad and we're stuck in a situation where we're overpaying that same guy we already had locked up just to keep him happy, which is preventing the team from spending adequate money elsewhere to make the overall team better
The decision to forego the obvious path in lieu of zagging just to zag was full of nothing but arrogance, and it needs to cost him his job. It was a decision filled with zero logic that's been executed about as poorly.
The best way to turn it around now is to fire the captain, tear it all down and start over. It's going to be a shitty couple of years but it's the only way forward at this point. Otherwise we're just staring at rudderless complacent blow-average mediocrity. And that's even worse.
Since'61
November 03, 2022 at 12:29 pm
The Packers have been an unguided missile since TT's health began going downhill. Even since Gute took over as GM his 1st round picks of Savage, Love and Stokes are questionable at best. He hit on Alexander and he hit on Gary. But moving up and taking Love when Rodgers was still more than capable of playing well is proving out to be a strategic disaster. Love has given the Packers nothing to date. We could have had a WR who would now be in his third season and very likely our #1 WR with Lazard, Doubs and Toure as our complimentary WRs.
Bak is nearing the end of his playing days leaving us with Jenkins as our only elite OL when he is healthy. The right side of the OL is uncompetitive against the league's better DLs. No one can accuse Gute of not trying to build the defense. 6 first round picks on defense but to date only Alexander and Gary are fitting that status. Savage won't tackle, Stokes has regressed, Walker and Wyatt have yet to make an impact.
First the Packers appeared to be ready to move on from Rodgers when they picked Love but when they didn't trade Rodgers they appeared to go all in for an SB run. Problem is they let 3 starting OLs walk and they traded away their best WR with no quality replacement in sight. How could they get it so wrong with a 2 time MVP QB in 2020 and 2021? Apparently they expected Rodgers to block, throw passes and catch them all at the same time.
On top of everything else it has taken our coaches 8 games to figure out that we should run the ball more than 10 - 12 times per game!!!??? Questionable decisions by management and by the coaching staff has left the players confused and listless on the field. The Packers appear to be bouncing from one strategy to another.
The defensive strategy has been ineffective and the offense is still working through their OL and WR personnel issues. They may have found some answers on the OL and at WR but it is likely too late to save the season. Inexcusable situation with what is an alleged professional organization. The Board should be working on their list of replacement candidates for Murphy. It is time. Thanks, Since '61
T7Steve
November 03, 2022 at 12:58 pm
Good one Since '61 you and CW along with the others are on it today.
You said:
"On top of everything is has taken our coaches 8 games to figure out that we should run the ball more than 10 - 12 times per game!!!??"
Why did it take so long to figure out the O-line too? How long has it been since we've all talked about this during camp. Had to go a couple weeks without Bakh and Jenkins but come on!
The GMs and stuff are above my pay grade, and I'll leave it to you guys but even I understand the basic leadership skills, Xs & Os.
vin0770
November 03, 2022 at 03:34 pm
Gute didn’t go out and try to add…hmmm…that doesn’t sound correct after listening to AR discuss what they tried 🤔
Starrbrite
November 04, 2022 at 12:27 am
When the Packers failed to fire Drayton, it spoke volumes concerning their inept decision making.
I, for one, believed we would compete for a championship this year. After losing to the Vikings, I excused the loss due to our history of seeming always starting slow. But, I did immediately question our defensive effort. I had believed the headlines we would be outstanding. I do not believe it’s the defensive talent; I believe it’s coaching.
As for LeFluke…well…?
I originally thought he was a good hire. And coming from the Shanahan coaching tree, I was hopeful. But, he’s a DuFus!! What scheme? The Play calling? Time management? Critical decision choices? I don’t see anything—inspite of his glorified record?
Flapping his arms on the sideline as if he escaped from a rehab facility.
So what do we do—what can we do? I know the answer—do y’all?
BTW, that beer looks awesome and I’ll be trying one (or 5) when I travel to Green Bay for the Dallas game.
Go Packers!!